From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Thu Oct  1 08:05:35 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2020 08:05:35 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Randwick 4
In-Reply-To: <001001d696f9$db0b6af0$912240d0$@tpg.com.au>
References: <00a901d696f4$5a935540$0fb9ffc0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<001001d696f9$db0b6af0$912240d0$@tpg.com.au>
Message-ID: <00f501d69775$d5411b70$7fc35250$@ozemail.com.au>



 

 

Mike,

 

The missus is a newcomer to watching races, but she said "Must have been
paid".

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of mikemcbain at tpg.com.au
Sent: Wednesday, 30 September 2020 17:18 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

Len

 

I saw that but how about the first four Jocks blocking my #8 Jailbreak? That
must have been one of Nash Rawiller's worst rides? Too me it looked like the
result had been organised in the change room?

 

Mike.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, 30 September 2020 16:39
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

I'm spending too much time watching races and too little in the pub, so I
watched Randwick 4, in which I had backed #3 place only.

 

WTF did JMcDonald, riding #2, turn his head "180 degrees" to look behind him
about 15m from the post, throwing the horse off balance and letting my #3
snatch 3rd? He "must" get suspended!

 

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From conceptracing at bigpond.com  Thu Oct  1 16:02:58 2020
From: conceptracing at bigpond.com (Ken Blake)
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2020 14:02:58 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Randwick 4
In-Reply-To: <00f501d69775$d5411b70$7fc35250$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <00a901d696f4$5a935540$0fb9ffc0$@ozemail.com.au>	<001001d696f9$db0b6af0$912240d0$@tpg.com.au>
	<00f501d69775$d5411b70$7fc35250$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <000d01d697b8$83d52950$8b7f7bf0$@bigpond.com>

Official Steward's Report:

 

Jailbreak - had to be checked approaching the winning post when Xanthus,
after shifting out, was corrected by its rider and shifted in abruptly. An
inquiry was opened into N Rawiller's riding of the gelding in the home
straight. After taking evidence from N Rawiller, the Stewards adjourned the
matter to conduct further analysis on the race.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Thursday, October 1, 2020 6:06 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 



 

 

Mike,

 

The missus is a newcomer to watching races, but she said "Must have been
paid".

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of mikemcbain at tpg.com.au
<mailto:mikemcbain at tpg.com.au> 
Sent: Wednesday, 30 September 2020 17:18 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

Len

 

I saw that but how about the first four Jocks blocking my #8 Jailbreak? That
must have been one of Nash Rawiller's worst rides? Too me it looked like the
result had been organised in the change room?

 

Mike.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, 30 September 2020 16:39
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

I'm spending too much time watching races and too little in the pub, so I
watched Randwick 4, in which I had backed #3 place only.

 

WTF did JMcDonald, riding #2, turn his head "180 degrees" to look behind him
about 15m from the post, throwing the horse off balance and letting my #3
snatch 3rd? He "must" get suspended!

 

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From mikemcbain at tpg.com.au  Thu Oct  1 17:06:26 2020
From: mikemcbain at tpg.com.au (mikemcbain at tpg.com.au)
Date: Thu, 1 Oct 2020 17:06:26 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Randwick 4
In-Reply-To: <000d01d697b8$83d52950$8b7f7bf0$@bigpond.com>
References: <00a901d696f4$5a935540$0fb9ffc0$@ozemail.com.au>	<001001d696f9$db0b6af0$912240d0$@tpg.com.au>	<00f501d69775$d5411b70$7fc35250$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000d01d697b8$83d52950$8b7f7bf0$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <004f01d697c1$618ef750$24ace5f0$@tpg.com.au>

Thanks Len & Ken

 

Jailbreak happened to be my biggest bet of the week and I managed to get
$7.40 about it so I am crying through my kick!

 

Mike.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of Ken Blake
Sent: Thursday, 1 October 2020 16:03
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

Official Steward's Report:

 

Jailbreak - had to be checked approaching the winning post when Xanthus,
after shifting out, was corrected by its rider and shifted in abruptly. An
inquiry was opened into N Rawiller's riding of the gelding in the home
straight. After taking evidence from N Rawiller, the Stewards adjourned the
matter to conduct further analysis on the race.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Thursday, October 1, 2020 6:06 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 



 

 

Mike,

 

The missus is a newcomer to watching races, but she said "Must have been
paid".

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of mikemcbain at tpg.com.au
<mailto:mikemcbain at tpg.com.au> 
Sent: Wednesday, 30 September 2020 17:18 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

Len

 

I saw that but how about the first four Jocks blocking my #8 Jailbreak? That
must have been one of Nash Rawiller's worst rides? Too me it looked like the
result had been organised in the change room?

 

Mike.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, 30 September 2020 16:39
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Randwick 4

 

I'm spending too much time watching races and too little in the pub, so I
watched Randwick 4, in which I had backed #3 place only.

 

WTF did JMcDonald, riding #2, turn his head "180 degrees" to look behind him
about 15m from the post, throwing the horse off balance and letting my #3
snatch 3rd? He "must" get suspended!

 

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Sun Oct  4 03:13:46 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2020 03:13:46 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
Message-ID: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD - M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS - Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
trust the data I have.

 

LBL

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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Sun Oct  4 10:42:35 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Sun, 4 Oct 2020 09:42:35 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>

Len, go to hong kong.

the top weight gets scratched.

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed
to no 1.

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

cleaning data the bane of my life.

cheers sean

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:
>
>
>
>
>
> The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
> show:
>
> 2 Presley Road
>
> T: Damien Rideout
>
> J: Matthew McGillivray
>
> 6 Blame It On Paris
>
> T: Zoe Hohn
>
> J: Emma Bell
>
>
>
> While the Stewards' report shows:
>
>
>
> Summary of rider changes/Late notifications
>
> Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray
>
>               BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White
>
>
>
> This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
> trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:
>
>
>
> Adelaide River,
>
> Atherton,
>
> Barraba,
>
> Bluff,
>
> Bundarra,
>
> Buchan
>
>
>
> And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
> trust the data I have.
>
>
>
> LBL
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct  5 04:15:58 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 04:15:58 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct  5 04:51:48 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 04:51:48 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>

Then yesterday, Hobart 6/8 Our Artie, definitely ran - I've seen the replay, but given as a scratching on TasRacing's web-site, and on WATAB, albeit with tote prices displayed, but not on TAB's site which displays Fixed and tote prices.

 

Weighed in light? Have to wait for the Steward's report for that one. Or Mike McBain.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct  5 05:02:51 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 05:02:51 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <001801d69a78$950d5400$bf27fc00$@ozemail.com.au>

And women jockeys - one day she's LDoodt, the next LBoyd.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:52 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then yesterday, Hobart 6/8 Our Artie, definitely ran - I've seen the replay, but given as a scratching on TasRacing's web-site, and on WATAB, albeit with tote prices displayed, but not on TAB's site which displays Fixed and tote prices.

 

Weighed in light? Have to wait for the Steward's report for that one. Or Mike McBain.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Mon Oct  5 07:01:07 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 06:01:07 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>

i have it as scratched.

On Mon, Oct 5, 2020 at 3:52 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> Then yesterday, Hobart 6/8 Our Artie, definitely ran - I've seen the
> replay, but given as a scratching on TasRacing's web-site, and on WATAB,
> albeit with tote prices displayed, but not on TAB's site which displays
> Fixed and tote prices.
>
>
>
> Weighed in light? Have to wait for the Steward's report for that one. Or
> Mike McBain.
>
>
>
> *From:* Racing *On Behalf Of *L.B.Loveday
> *Sent:* Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
> *To:* 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [AusRace] Data Bases
>
>
>
> Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100%
> because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not
> reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to
> promote their systems.
>
> I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple
> method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account
> the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.
>
>
>
> Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.
>
>
>
> Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on
> Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first
> 2 favourites, #2 and #6:
>
>
>
> However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering
> actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula
> used to determine SOP.
>
>
>
> Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that
> day so impacted, the others were ok.
>
>
>
> And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Racing *On Behalf Of *sean mclaren
> *Sent:* Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
> *To:* AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [AusRace] Data Bases
>
>
>
> Len, go to hong kong.
>
>
>
> the top weight gets scratched.
>
>
>
> the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed
> to no 1.
>
>
>
> when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.
>
>
>
> my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !
>
>
>
> cleaning data the bane of my life.
>
>
>
> cheers sean
>
>
>
> On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au>
> wrote:
>
> An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:
>
>
>
>
>
> The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
> show:
>
> 2 Presley Road
>
> T: Damien Rideout
>
> J: Matthew McGillivray
>
> 6 Blame It On Paris
>
> T: Zoe Hohn
>
> J: Emma Bell
>
>
>
> While the Stewards' report shows:
>
>
>
> Summary of rider changes/Late notifications
>
> Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray
>
>               BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White
>
>
>
> This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
> trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:
>
>
>
> Adelaide River,
>
> Atherton,
>
> Barraba,
>
> Bluff,
>
> Bundarra,
>
> Buchan
>
>
>
> And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
> trust the data I have.
>
>
>
> LBL
>
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Mon Oct  5 07:03:59 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 06:03:59 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-R7USQ32e+LsLz=Fyi2EyQKd1mrHNKEvdkG5VP_-RWk3Q@mail.gmail.com>

i have n day as jockey. yuk.

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:
>
>
>
>
>
> The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
> show:
>
> 2 Presley Road
>
> T: Damien Rideout
>
> J: Matthew McGillivray
>
> 6 Blame It On Paris
>
> T: Zoe Hohn
>
> J: Emma Bell
>
>
>
> While the Stewards' report shows:
>
>
>
> Summary of rider changes/Late notifications
>
> Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray
>
>               BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White
>
>
>
> This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
> trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:
>
>
>
> Adelaide River,
>
> Atherton,
>
> Barraba,
>
> Bluff,
>
> Bundarra,
>
> Buchan
>
>
>
> And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
> trust the data I have.
>
>
>
> LBL
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct  5 08:39:22 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 08:39:22 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <002a01d69a96$d50a1cf0$7f1e56d0$@ozemail.com.au>

Here's WATAB's take:

 



 

Betting closed 15:45:44; Scheduled starting time was 15:45, so that ties in

 



 

Horse scratched 14:41. But bookmakers were betting on it to the jump at 15:45:45, and a horse with saddle cloth #8, named as Our Artie by the caller definitely ran.

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 7:01 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

i have it as scratched.

 

On Mon, Oct 5, 2020 at 3:52 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

Then yesterday, Hobart 6/8 Our Artie, definitely ran - I've seen the replay, but given as a scratching on TasRacing's web-site, and on WATAB, albeit with tote prices displayed, but not on TAB's site which displays Fixed and tote prices.

 

Weighed in light? Have to wait for the Steward's report for that one. Or Mike McBain.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From mikemcbain at tpg.com.au  Mon Oct  5 09:22:52 2020
From: mikemcbain at tpg.com.au (mikemcbain at tpg.com.au)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 09:22:52 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <002801d69a9c$e6aea830$b40bf890$@tpg.com.au>

Sorry Len, but I can?t think of a worse day out than actually going to the races here in Tas these days.

And my days of having a beer or game of squash with the Trainers, Jockeys and Stewards are over unfortunately.

 

Mike.

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 04:52
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then yesterday, Hobart 6/8 Our Artie, definitely ran - I've seen the replay, but given as a scratching on TasRacing's web-site, and on WATAB, albeit with tote prices displayed, but not on TAB's site which displays Fixed and tote prices.

 

Weighed in light? Have to wait for the Steward's report for that one. Or Mike McBain.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct  5 21:39:34 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 5 Oct 2020 21:39:34 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000001d69b03$d2b0d620$78128260$@ozemail.com.au>

Beaudesert Race 6 today highlights the difference between SP (SOP) and individual bookmakers' prices. The late scratching of the favourite#3 resulted in a SP market of 104.7%, while Bet365 was betting 79.5% with deductions applicable to bets at either.

 

 

 

From: L.B.Loveday 
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: RE: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Tue Oct  6 06:57:32 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2020 06:57:32 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <000001d69b51$c54e0810$4fea1830$@ozemail.com.au>

Now re-instated on TasRacing. Definite runner.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 7:01 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

i have it as scratched.

 

On Mon, Oct 5, 2020 at 3:52 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

Then yesterday, Hobart 6/8 Our Artie, definitely ran - I've seen the replay, but given as a scratching on TasRacing's web-site, and on WATAB, albeit with tote prices displayed, but not on TAB's site which displays Fixed and tote prices.

 

Weighed in light? Have to wait for the Steward's report for that one. Or Mike McBain.

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 5 October 2020 4:16 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Then there are the SP markets, which in about 0.6% of times are <100% because of barrier scratchings, and in many other cases low 100s, not reflecting the real SP after deductions, but are still used by touts to promote their systems. 

I calculate a normalised 100% market for every race, not by the simple method of dividing each price by the market%*100, but taking into account the "long shot effect" and use that as the basis for comparing returns.

 

Using on-line bookmakers prices is also fraught.

 

Here's the final prices as per Dynamic Odds from a number of bookmakers on Race 7 at the Sunshine Coast 27/9/2020:

 

 



 

The discrepancy between the BBet and the others is obvious from the first 2 favourites, #2 and #6:

 

However, the SPs are right, so the SOPs have been determined considering actual final prices from the (10?) designated bookmakers and the formula used to determine SOP.

 

Why is BBet the only one right? I can't know, but there were 21 races that day so impacted, the others were ok.

 

And so on; Life was not meant to be easy, and is not easy for punters.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 10:43 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

Len, go to hong kong.

 

the top weight gets scratched.

 

the emergency no 13, gets a run; and in HK it's TAB number now has changed to no 1.

 

when the emergency wins, and as it is now no. 1.

 

my data provider credits the scratched horse as the winner !

 

cleaning data the bane of my life. 

 

cheers sean

 

On Sun, Oct 4, 2020 at 2:15 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Tue Oct  6 07:02:44 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2020 07:02:44 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] TAB - keeping customers informed
Message-ID: <000601d69b52$7ea367b0$7bea3710$@ozemail.com.au>



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From greg.j.conroy at gmail.com  Tue Oct  6 14:20:12 2020
From: greg.j.conroy at gmail.com (Greg Conroy)
Date: Tue, 6 Oct 2020 14:20:12 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] My first book - available now! Discount for you all!
In-Reply-To: <000001d69b51$c54e0810$4fea1830$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001d69b51$c54e0810$4fea1830$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <AC17A100-EE96-476A-90B6-71FF1C0C095F@gmail.com>


Hi all,

During lockdown I?ve finished my first book - decades of punting intelligence - called Win Without Form.

Taken over a year to finish - I had many pre-purchases last year and thus there?s some brilliant feedback already available upon launch.

As a launch bonus for my Ausrace friends - use PROMO code (on final part of checkout) of ?25OFF? and receive a 25% discount. 

(Offer closes 11pm this Sunday)

Guarantee what?s inside will change the way you think about punting. 

And even some of my $20 punters that have bought it have told me they have won enough to cover the purchase in the first week.

(In fact Donald R2 just run was an example of the OONV system that comes as a bonus with the book)

Check it out here: www.winwithoutform.com <http://www.winwithoutform.com/>


Cheers, Greg.



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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct  7 07:11:41 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 07:11:41 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>

Hi L.B

 

Apologies for the misunderstanding.

 

Zoe White was definitely the rider of BLAME IT ON PARIS at Yeppoon on that
day.

 

Initially Emma Bell was down to ride the horse but unfortunately couldn't
attend the meeting.

 

I'm unaware of why the RQ website is still displaying Emma Bell when the
riding change was effected 24 hours prior, but it is something I will chase
up with RQ

 

Thanks for bringing this to our attention and apologies once again

 

Tate Hudson

Stipendiary Steward

Rockhampton

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 3:14 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
show:

 

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

 

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

 

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD - M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS - Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
trust the data I have.

 

LBL

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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Wed Oct  7 07:14:24 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 06:14:24 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-QPWFrAmXaeqdYzaOd0azV-CJsr3N6Q5J+M7ssJM=3zFQ@mail.gmail.com>

date?

On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:12 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> Hi L.B
>
>
>
> Apologies for the misunderstanding.
>
>
>
> Zoe White was definitely the rider of BLAME IT ON PARIS at Yeppoon on that
> day.
>
>
>
> Initially Emma Bell was down to ride the horse but unfortunately couldn?t
> attend the meeting.
>
>
>
> I?m unaware of why the RQ website is still displaying Emma Bell when the
> riding change was effected 24 hours prior, but it is something I will chase
> up with RQ
>
>
>
> Thanks for bringing this to our attention and apologies once again
>
>
>
> Tate Hudson
>
> Stipendiary Steward
>
> Rockhampton
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Racing *On Behalf Of *L.B.Loveday
> *Sent:* Sunday, 4 October 2020 3:14 AM
> *To:* 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
> *Subject:* [AusRace] Data Bases
>
>
>
> An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:
>
>
>
>
>
> The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
> show:
>
>
>
> 2 Presley Road
>
> T: Damien Rideout
>
> J: Matthew McGillivray
>
>
>
> 6 Blame It On Paris
>
> T: Zoe Hohn
>
> J: Emma Bell
>
>
>
> While the Stewards' report shows:
>
>
>
> Summary of rider changes/Late notifications
>
>
>
> Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray
>
>               BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White
>
>
>
> This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
> trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:
>
>
>
> Adelaide River,
>
> Atherton,
>
> Barraba,
>
> Bluff,
>
> Bundarra,
>
> Buchan
>
>
>
> And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
> trust the data I have.
>
>
>
> LBL
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Wed Oct  7 07:16:03 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 06:16:03 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-R4p3ohh15jgRtiCmLFTqX95xsoPgWnNM+=9ANBCt_s7w@mail.gmail.com>

i have zoe white as the jock. 1st oct.

On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:12 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> Hi L.B
>
>
>
> Apologies for the misunderstanding.
>
>
>
> Zoe White was definitely the rider of BLAME IT ON PARIS at Yeppoon on that
> day.
>
>
>
> Initially Emma Bell was down to ride the horse but unfortunately couldn?t
> attend the meeting.
>
>
>
> I?m unaware of why the RQ website is still displaying Emma Bell when the
> riding change was effected 24 hours prior, but it is something I will chase
> up with RQ
>
>
>
> Thanks for bringing this to our attention and apologies once again
>
>
>
> Tate Hudson
>
> Stipendiary Steward
>
> Rockhampton
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Racing *On Behalf Of *L.B.Loveday
> *Sent:* Sunday, 4 October 2020 3:14 AM
> *To:* 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
> *Subject:* [AusRace] Data Bases
>
>
>
> An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:
>
>
>
>
>
> The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
> show:
>
>
>
> 2 Presley Road
>
> T: Damien Rideout
>
> J: Matthew McGillivray
>
>
>
> 6 Blame It On Paris
>
> T: Zoe Hohn
>
> J: Emma Bell
>
>
>
> While the Stewards' report shows:
>
>
>
> Summary of rider changes/Late notifications
>
>
>
> Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray
>
>               BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White
>
>
>
> This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
> trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:
>
>
>
> Adelaide River,
>
> Atherton,
>
> Barraba,
>
> Bluff,
>
> Bundarra,
>
> Buchan
>
>
>
> And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
> trust the data I have.
>
>
>
> LBL
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct  7 07:31:34 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 07:31:34 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <CAOBDE-QPWFrAmXaeqdYzaOd0azV-CJsr3N6Q5J+M7ssJM=3zFQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-QPWFrAmXaeqdYzaOd0azV-CJsr3N6Q5J+M7ssJM=3zFQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001401d69c1f$b0cb48c0$1261da40$@ozemail.com.au>

Highlighted below.

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Wednesday, 7 October 2020 7:14 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

date?

 

On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:12 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

Hi L.B

 

Apologies for the misunderstanding.

 

Zoe White was definitely the rider of BLAME IT ON PARIS at Yeppoon on that day.

 

Initially Emma Bell was down to ride the horse but unfortunately couldn?t attend the meeting.

 

I?m unaware of why the RQ website is still displaying Emma Bell when the riding change was effected 24 hours prior, but it is something I will chase up with RQ

 

Thanks for bringing this to our attention and apologies once again

 

Tate Hudson

Stipendiary Steward

Rockhampton

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 3:14 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

 

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

 

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

 

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct  7 07:32:52 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 07:32:52 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <CAOBDE-R4p3ohh15jgRtiCmLFTqX95xsoPgWnNM+=9ANBCt_s7w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>	<000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-R4p3ohh15jgRtiCmLFTqX95xsoPgWnNM+=9ANBCt_s7w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <001901d69c1f$df173e50$9d45baf0$@ozemail.com.au>

I get jockeys from 2 sources as a cross-check. One gave ZWhite, one gave EBell

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of sean mclaren
Sent: Wednesday, 7 October 2020 7:16 AM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

i have zoe white as the jock. 1st oct.

 

On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:12 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > wrote:

Hi L.B

 

Apologies for the misunderstanding.

 

Zoe White was definitely the rider of BLAME IT ON PARIS at Yeppoon on that day.

 

Initially Emma Bell was down to ride the horse but unfortunately couldn?t attend the meeting.

 

I?m unaware of why the RQ website is still displaying Emma Bell when the riding change was effected 24 hours prior, but it is something I will chase up with RQ

 

Thanks for bringing this to our attention and apologies once again

 

Tate Hudson

Stipendiary Steward

Rockhampton

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Sunday, 4 October 2020 3:14 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases

 

An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:

 

 

The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site show:

 

2 Presley Road

T: Damien Rideout

J: Matthew McGillivray

 

6 Blame It On Paris

T: Zoe Hohn

J: Emma Bell

 

While the Stewards' report shows:

 

Summary of rider changes/Late notifications

 

Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray

              BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White

 

This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:

 

Adelaide River,

Atherton,

Barraba,

Bluff,

Bundarra,

Buchan

 

And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't trust the data I have.

 

LBL

_______________________________________________
Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct  7 11:45:22 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 11:45:22 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] (no subject)
Message-ID: <005a01d69c43$278185b0$76849110$@ozemail.com.au>

 

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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Wed Oct  7 14:46:29 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2020 13:46:29 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Data Bases
In-Reply-To: <001901d69c1f$df173e50$9d45baf0$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000001d69c1c$e9c55790$bd5006b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-R4p3ohh15jgRtiCmLFTqX95xsoPgWnNM+=9ANBCt_s7w@mail.gmail.com>
	<001901d69c1f$df173e50$9d45baf0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-RDv6mnjd6=5Ry5Z6LpyM7J3oT634YwpWTOFXawir_D8w@mail.gmail.com>

hong kong is keeping me awake at night. dogs breakfast.
i get data from 3 sources. 2 paid , the other web scrape.

On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:33 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> I get jockeys from 2 sources as a cross-check. One gave ZWhite, one gave
> EBell
>
>
>
> *From:* Racing *On Behalf Of *sean mclaren
> *Sent:* Wednesday, 7 October 2020 7:16 AM
> *To:* AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
> *Subject:* Re: [AusRace] Data Bases
>
>
>
> i have zoe white as the jock. 1st oct.
>
>
>
> On Wed, Oct 7, 2020 at 6:12 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au>
> wrote:
>
> Hi L.B
>
>
>
> Apologies for the misunderstanding.
>
>
>
> Zoe White was definitely the rider of BLAME IT ON PARIS at Yeppoon on that
> day.
>
>
>
> Initially Emma Bell was down to ride the horse but unfortunately couldn?t
> attend the meeting.
>
>
>
> I?m unaware of why the RQ website is still displaying Emma Bell when the
> riding change was effected 24 hours prior, but it is something I will chase
> up with RQ
>
>
>
> Thanks for bringing this to our attention and apologies once again
>
>
>
> Tate Hudson
>
> Stipendiary Steward
>
> Rockhampton
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* Racing *On Behalf Of *L.B.Loveday
> *Sent:* Sunday, 4 October 2020 3:14 AM
> *To:* 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
> *Subject:* [AusRace] Data Bases
>
>
>
> An example of how hard it is to keep data bases accurate:
>
>
>
>
>
> The results for Yeppoon Race 5, October 1 on Racing Queensland's web-site
> show:
>
>
>
> 2 Presley Road
>
> T: Damien Rideout
>
> J: Matthew McGillivray
>
>
>
> 6 Blame It On Paris
>
> T: Zoe Hohn
>
> J: Emma Bell
>
>
>
> While the Stewards' report shows:
>
>
>
> Summary of rider changes/Late notifications
>
>
>
> Race 5.  PRESLEY ROAD ? M McGillivray
>
>               BLAME IT ON PARIS ? Z White
>
>
>
> This is far from a rare occurrence! I don't even bother trying to keep
> trainers accurate - they have Gai running horses at:
>
>
>
> Adelaide River,
>
> Atherton,
>
> Barraba,
>
> Bluff,
>
> Bundarra,
>
> Buchan
>
>
>
> And that's just the A and B's. Maybe she did, I can't know, but I don't
> trust the data I have.
>
>
>
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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Thu Oct  8 12:02:01 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2020 09:02:01 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Over Wheeo - Form study back in the day - a system
Message-ID: <000001d69d0e$a2571f90$e7055eb0$@bigpond.com>

OVER WHEEO - long and not much connected with the punt.

Uncle Bill* and his punting ways - 

Form Study back in the day

* He wasn't an Uncle either, a school mate of Dads, but they had been
through a lot together, boarding school, rowing, 1stXV, running, a war (and
10 years of that as well- Dad was a Lieutenant, paid as a Captain, acting up
as a Major, and Bill was a W/O, Construction/Support, so he got shot up,
bombed, strafed, V2'd, the first construction at a new site was a hole in
the ground, way deep, out of sight)

What Bill did, most times, was manipulate the form figures against a horses
name in the race book. He started with a base line figure of 9, hopeless he
called them. Argus may have 4515 as it's previous form and Bill worked that
as 4 minus 9, = minus 5, then minus 5 minus 5 =0, then 0 minus 1= -9, then 5
less (minus)9 = -4 - and there was probably an easier example around also.
Later, he changed (simplified?) this calculation to 9 minus 4 = 5 plus 9
minus 5 = 4 plus 9 minus 1 = 8 plus 9 minus 5 =4 so (5+4+9+5 = 23) the
horses value for this race and essentially the number of horse lengths this
runner had beaten to get here, again assuming nothing had a value of greater
than 9, in any event he bought them all back to that, hopeless he said,
again. This last sum/equation was a secret divulged by a bookie analyst. I
have not seen it since, and again, essentially, it shows the number of
runners this runner has beaten to get here..  Later, in his ever changing
world due to impulsivity, he just multiplied the form figures together then
divided that sum by the biggest number (allowing for one bad run in a stream
of 4) and went with that - I told him about this. It went 4*5*1*5 =100
divided by the 'worst' multiplicand (a 5) = 100/5 = 20 as a form value for
that runner.

Bill was ex RAAF/RAF, but not a pilot - he came to that later when gliding
popularity peaked. 

His glider plane was a Blanik (I think) which was devoid of all markings
anyway, it was a preparatory silver paint before the final colours were to
be decided, and those were maybe silver too. Nearly there he said,
paintwise, although the whole thing was a work in progress. A gliding
association annoyed him, with their insistence on him registering both,
himself and the aircraft, and how are they going to know who he was, whose
plane is it. Bill solved this by writing his name on the thing, near the
hatch catch, and he always had his scapular, it got him through the war so
why wouldn't you, and Grandmother had embroided his number and name on the
tag anyway. He never knew his parents, and told me he was raised in a
circus, but this was not true. He was raised by a matriach, one of
many/dozens of children similarly cared for (as was my Mother dear - she
said Ashtons had bigger tents but they had better clowns, meaning comedic
episodes, so may be Bills assertion of a childhood in a circus is true!!)

He flew from, to, and over Wheeo where he owned acres, a sheep station
amongst others, and where there was a strip, again Ex Airforce and due north
of Fairbairn, and you could see that aerodrome, 60 miles or more away, with
the continual coming and going of aircraft there. 

Where Bill flew, glided then, was high too, his strip was probably 3000 feet
ASL, and he was 900 to 1000 feet above that, not that you could tell because
there was a hole for an altimeter, and in fact there were 4 holes for
various guages, indicators, displays and all four were in a Reschs box in
the back of his Landy, down there somewhere.

The tow plane came to him, either on the place, or at the Council strip, and
up and off he went, sometimes for several hours some days then he would try
to circle back, spiral up and down, across and to and if he didn't land at
home, he tied her down and rang Dad, and Dad rang me, and off I went on my
motorbike and brought him back to his Landrover, or sometimes, to our house.
A shower to warm up, food because he rarely ate otherwise, beer because it
is thirsty work for all adults, living, and off we went to get his Land
Rover, glider trailer, and many times at midnight or later, by the loom of
headlights, we took apart his airplane, put it into the trailer, and away he
went for another week or so, some meals included. 

It wasn't dangerous, nor would it be coming down to ground as he did, a long
drift then a gentle flair just before the end and a tender run of less than
100 feet to a stop, more often on the strip, sometimes not but decided upon
from up on high. Once he had to stop his descent to clear a train and once
he had to scramble out to scare away cattle, bulls at that, and those bulls
were fruity, whatever that is.

Re-assembling the aircraft was the obligation of Onions and Stodge, his
neighbours, retired, who lived on opposite sides of the same road, 12 miles
apart with Bills station in-between. Both were JPs, or had been,
councillors, or had been, one was Ex Army, one was Ex Navy, one kind of
believed he deserved a Knighthood, because others of his had been so
deserving, and both their properties,stations, or all three perhaps, were
accessed by military persons-in-training. 

Bill had married well, several times.

He leased his station to a hereford heifer breeding and fattening company.
Others, his radial neighbours, stuck with their sheep. Cows he reckons have
a Union, they can only eat for a set number of minutes and hours each day,
and in that individual time they consume what feed they can. More than
enough, fat cow, just enough, store cow, some calories less than that, dry
cow, and no matter what you do to entice them to eat more, or less, they
won't, union rules you see. If its good grass, which it rarely is, all of
them prosper. They don't starve, don't worry, but they do spend all of their
waking hours, and some of their sleeping hours, trying to kill themselves.
Poison from bacteria, or getting bogged, or drowning while getting bogged,
lightning, getting caught and cut in a fence, dogs, dingos, sunlight, rain,
wind, jumping at shadows, anything and everything is detrimental. What Bill
found, not just once either, were sneaky cows hidden in the crooks of the
creeks, down out of the way, out of sight, while their sisters were rounded
up and trucked off, calf full most of them. The company counted out an
acceptable number into the trucks, I'm guessing, and knowing the ability of
cattle to die may have concluded they had in fact met their demise as
expected. These 'cleanskins' became the property of Bill, by rote or by the
application of that good old country rule, possession is nine tenths of
something. Anyway, neighbours, friends, associates, but not us by agreement,
shared in a butchered feast, if they weren't to be mothers, in which case
they were sold off with calf at foot.

He had his house, friends, female and male, and a good life, on country that
was all slopes, all underlain by granite which grew through the green often,
and always a breeze between gentle to double or more of that. It was the
breeze that worked here, when the leading edges of the wing turn into it
everything got lifted and aloft you went, quietly although not silently, the
wind noise remained, the occasional bang of a line working an elevator or an
aileron, and an ability to sneak up on birds, likewise soaring, and to look
down and see your shadow moving at walking speed over the slopes. The
granite was in stripes and showing where folds of it struck on to the
north-west. There was basalt too, but this was leaving with the wind and the
rain, and its red soil was caught up in the lines and dimples of the
granite. Granite is formed in the deep earth, 12 miles in at least, and
basalt gets vomited onto the surface to decay and leak as it does, as I
said. Either way erosion in all its facets had removed a lot of rock
overall. The Lachlan River helped there, as did The Fish, The Reedy, The
Orb, The Crooked, Thompsons, Rugby, and The Dill, Dry, Wet, Wide, Gneiss,
Lyons, Parkes, Pontifica and Catholic Creeks, Presbyterian and Latin
Gullies. Naming of water features did not involve consultation with the
early inhabitants, apparently. Bill referred to his place as Episcopalian
Ridge (Pleurisy Plains was more apt!). Eastern Australia grew from west to
east it seems, gradually accreting its rocks in stripes as it did, some of
it beneath a sea to be pushed up into the air, and exposure, by compression,
again from the east now. 

Bill went to the Carnivals, not Melbourne so much, but certainly in Sydney,
and yearly to Brisbane when drinking was done and sleeping was optional.
There was punting information given out freely, every owner may have a
winning belief in theirs, but Bill never listened, and nor was he a big
punter, but he enjoyed form study and particularly enjoyed the proof of his
decisions when his decision won, or at the least beat home the choices of
others. 

There seemed, to me, to be a different girl too, every time, and always the
steady Connie who had been a constant for 18 years or so and Mums choice.
But Connie went, as did the others also, and really the only constant was
Bills philandering, which he didn't think was a problem, and he remained
unaffected from his singularity, which never lasted long anyway.

Nobody, other than Bill, worked the place too. Every post on his road
frontage was concrete, and these same posts formed the lines rising up off
the creeks so that a fire, expected from the north most often, would not
affect anything much. The fire lines were renewed yearly in a great circle
around the house, sheds, yards and the oil laden gums removed to be replaced
by Yarrans, Coobas, Ironwoods in contoured placements until the Forestry
Commission used his home paddock picture on its calendar. 

Good bloke, living the good life.

Cheers

Tony



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From greg.j.conroy at gmail.com  Thu Oct  8 20:07:04 2020
From: greg.j.conroy at gmail.com (Greg Conroy)
Date: Thu, 8 Oct 2020 20:07:04 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] My first book - available now! Discount for you all!
In-Reply-To: <AC17A100-EE96-476A-90B6-71FF1C0C095F@gmail.com>
References: <005801d699a0$2e686920$8b393b60$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-S5RNJSW81NuGF1VJKHSjzqnzYUa7fbOKB2xfM=a5W4Jw@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001d69a72$08cf7050$1a6e50f0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000d01d69a77$0a429610$1ec7c230$@ozemail.com.au>
	<CAOBDE-Qs=PgVQnp890yu1k-+JaYVkjPyLRpbUMqh_SDaC9kvQQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<000001d69b51$c54e0810$4fea1830$@ozemail.com.au>
	<AC17A100-EE96-476A-90B6-71FF1C0C095F@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <66BEBA63-6DFE-46AE-917E-6D3D4E84B02A@gmail.com>

Hi all - sorry, thanks for the delay for all those that took up the offer below - I have to create your version manually!

Anyway, backlog cleared and those early adopters are drinking Champers tonight with this DOUBLE BET tip based on what is in the book.

I know most punters think they know it all - but believe me, you don?t know this - impossible, as I?m the only person in the world who has had the opportunity to be privy to this information over my career and I?m a clever cookie (10 patents) and worked out how to put all this together to make profits. 

TAB 20 years (created internet betting) / Betfair (first product executive) / Pro Punters (they use my stuff) / IT Guru, etc.

Look at the testimonials here, the second major one is from an ex bookie:

www.winwithoutform.com <http://www.winwithoutform.com/> 

And here?s today?s nice earner.



Bonus finishes Sunday. Remember ?25OFF? promo code for you all!


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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct 14 10:22:25 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2020 10:22:25 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f
In-Reply-To: <mailman.4.1602626404.3815346.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
References: <mailman.4.1602626404.3815346.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
Message-ID: <004401d6a1b7$b8419080$28c4b180$@ozemail.com.au>

Anyone else get this? It was auto-directed to my Junk folder.


-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of racing-request at ausrace.com
Sent: Wednesday, 14 October 2020 9:00 AM
To: lloveday at ozemail.com.au
Subject: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f

Your membership in the mailing list Racing has been disabled due to
excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated 07-Oct-2020.
You will not get any more messages from this list until you re-enable your
membership.  You will receive 2 more reminders like this before your
membership in the list is deleted.

To re-enable your membership, you can simply respond to this message
(leaving the Subject: line intact), or visit the confirmation page at

 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/confirm/racing_ausrace.com/bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddca
a8961182f97c61af0f


You can also visit your membership page at

 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/options/racing_ausrace.com/lloveday%40ozemail.com
.au


On your membership page, you can change various delivery options such as
your email address and whether you get digests or not.  As a reminder, your
membership password is

    guivegdo

If you have any questions or problems, you can contact the list owner at

    racing-owner at ausrace.com




From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct 14 10:51:17 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2020 10:51:17 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Caufield R4
Message-ID: <005001d6a1bb$bfcc93a0$3f65bae0$@ozemail.com.au>

I'm a statistician, not a racing expert.

 

So, can someone tell me why Caufield, mid-Caulfield Cup Carnival has a $400k
race with only 3 final acceptors?

 

LBL

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From conceptracing at bigpond.com  Wed Oct 14 11:10:50 2020
From: conceptracing at bigpond.com (Ken Blake)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2020 08:10:50 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Caufield R4
In-Reply-To: <005001d6a1bb$bfcc93a0$3f65bae0$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <005001d6a1bb$bfcc93a0$3f65bae0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <000001d6a1be$79cca040$6d65e0c0$@bigpond.com>

Very strange Len.this time of year we are normally looking at capacity
fields given what's on offer.

 

I'd be more than happy to run the course myself to pick up 4th prize money.

 

KB

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, October 14, 2020 7:51 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] Caufield R4

 

I'm a statistician, not a racing expert.

 

So, can someone tell me why Caufield, mid-Caulfield Cup Carnival has a $400k
race with only 3 final acceptors?

 

LBL

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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Wed Oct 14 11:12:17 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2020 10:12:17 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f
In-Reply-To: <004401d6a1b7$b8419080$28c4b180$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <mailman.4.1602626404.3815346.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
	<004401d6a1b7$b8419080$28c4b180$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-QKrtBCfezAq4-WNizLyp+AhsExquHdVuaatpBWHhe2ng@mail.gmail.com>

membership password is

    guivegdo

hey Len

your password you will need to change.

struggling to find my junk mail folder lol

cheers sean

On Wed, Oct 14, 2020 at 9:23 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> Anyone else get this? It was auto-directed to my Junk folder.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Racing On Behalf Of racing-request at ausrace.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 14 October 2020 9:00 AM
> To: lloveday at ozemail.com.au
> Subject: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f
>
> Your membership in the mailing list Racing has been disabled due to
> excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated 07-Oct-2020.
> You will not get any more messages from this list until you re-enable your
> membership.  You will receive 2 more reminders like this before your
> membership in the list is deleted.
>
> To re-enable your membership, you can simply respond to this message
> (leaving the Subject: line intact), or visit the confirmation page at
>
>
>
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/confirm/racing_ausrace.com/bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddca
> a8961182f97c61af0f
> <http://ausrace.com/mailman/confirm/racing_ausrace.com/bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f>
>
>
> You can also visit your membership page at
>
>
>
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/options/racing_ausrace.com/lloveday%40ozemail.com
> .au
>
>
> On your membership page, you can change various delivery options such as
> your email address and whether you get digests or not.  As a reminder, your
> membership password is
>
>     guivegdo
>
> If you have any questions or problems, you can contact the list owner at
>
>     racing-owner at ausrace.com
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From mikemcbain at tpg.com.au  Wed Oct 14 11:15:04 2020
From: mikemcbain at tpg.com.au (mikemcbain at tpg.com.au)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2020 11:15:04 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f
In-Reply-To: <004401d6a1b7$b8419080$28c4b180$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <mailman.4.1602626404.3815346.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
	<004401d6a1b7$b8419080$28c4b180$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <001001d6a1bf$11380dc0$33a82940$@tpg.com.au>

Yes Len I received that email too.

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, 14 October 2020 10:22
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f

Anyone else get this? It was auto-directed to my Junk folder.


-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of racing-request at ausrace.com
Sent: Wednesday, 14 October 2020 9:00 AM
To: lloveday at ozemail.com.au
Subject: confirm bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddcaa8961182f97c61af0f

Your membership in the mailing list Racing has been disabled due to
excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated 07-Oct-2020.
You will not get any more messages from this list until you re-enable your
membership.  You will receive 2 more reminders like this before your
membership in the list is deleted.

To re-enable your membership, you can simply respond to this message
(leaving the Subject: line intact), or visit the confirmation page at

 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/confirm/racing_ausrace.com/bf7f83be64e68c6f48ddca
a8961182f97c61af0f


You can also visit your membership page at

 
http://ausrace.com/mailman/options/racing_ausrace.com/lloveday%40ozemail.com
.au


On your membership page, you can change various delivery options such as
your email address and whether you get digests or not.  As a reminder, your
membership password is

    guivegdo

If you have any questions or problems, you can contact the list owner at

    racing-owner at ausrace.com


_______________________________________________
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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Wed Oct 14 12:09:19 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Wed, 14 Oct 2020 09:09:19 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Cube - a system
Message-ID: <003001d6a1c6$a57abfd0$f0703f70$@bigpond.com>

There are two with this name.

One, not discussed here, had you looking for runners with qualified form
figures, 111, 112, 113, 211, 212, 213 etc out to a 4** and 5**

The other was a bound booklet, hand printed and published in Sydney, with an
advertisement on the inside back cover (Mark Foy's store, in Sydney). On the
back cover is a cubist drawing which may be a slice of the piece 'Nude
descending the stairs' - I have seen stairs and the other things and no, I
don't see it, and yes, Saintly, I turned it every which way.

The author had you dividing the distance of todays race with a calculated
divisor (think 1200/16.5) then multiplying the result by the days since last
start, then squaring that result, then squaring it again.
They explained that there was a link between distance of race, and days
between runs. Sprinters took longer to recover, distance runners needed
quick turn-arounds to maintain/improve 'strength'.

The divisor I have shown is mid way between the 14.5 - 17.5 value they
calculated, depending on race distance/'length'. A table in the book advises
which divisor you should use - I have attempted to reverse engineer this,
looking for the input(s) used but it appears skewed towards sprint races.

I have not seen another system which is dependent on days since last start
as its only input. It does snare a few but is that because a quick back up
is dominant in form anyway? Or may be they lost the lollies last run,
because of a jockey error most likely, and they are in the hunt quickly to
get their funds back. Or may be those involved have seen something positive
and can't wait to use/utilise that knowledge now. Or whatever.


Cheers

Tony




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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Sun Oct 18 20:41:37 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2020 17:41:37 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system
Message-ID: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>

Sometimes, (alright, mostly) you can criticise horse racing system sellers
as snake oil salespersons living in a P O Box, in some other State. 

These next two systems were offered to buyers as a 'promotion'. If you were
considered royalty, or something else, you were offered the use of the
system, and when it paid you handsomely you repaid the faith by repaying the
ownership price, 50 pounds, with instalments if you cared for that. It
wasn't a P O Box either, but you sent money orders to a street address in
Bellambi and the accounting for that was your job too, you stopped when you
sent off the last instalment for a total of the 50. Who did that? 

I paid $10 for 8 system booklets, pre-owned, which included the first
version of this system, and I presume the original owner of mine did pay his
total.

Both systems are authored by the same persons I reckon, although they are
different to a degree. Forensically!, what is exact is the results, a year
almost of expanded results, and a dissertation on 5 years operation of the
first system.

System 1: For Sydney metro racing only, races for 3yo, and/or fillies and
mares races, or fillies, or mares, up to a mile (1600m)
(a) Consider only the three top trainers and their entries in this race -
there may be multiple entries (a la Waller, say, these days)
(b)Those entries are again examined and included if they meet certain
criteria
(i) weight less than 60 kg (133 pounds, 8 stones, 8 pounds) and that pounds
reference is an indicator of the systems origin in some other racing
jurisdiction, overseas somewhere.
(ii)last start finished less than 6th, second last start finished less than
6th.
(iii)contested a race within the last 56 days
(iv) it is not the favourite.

The essay on the workings of the system states that over a large number of
events the system scored 40+% winners at average odds of 4/1. Placegetters
scored 83%. 100 out 166? back.
Win betting was restricted to 9/1 or less - place betting was capped at 15/1
or less. Those figures quoted are not mine - I have tried to duplicate those
types of results for a while.

System 2: see summary for more explanations
(a) consider only the 4 top trainers and their entries this race. Score 1 -
4.
>From those contenders:
(b) weight less than 8 stones 8 pounds (60kg) Top weights 1, 2nd top weight
2 etc. Score 1 - 4
(c) last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4
(d) second last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4
(e) last start within 20 days =1, last start between 21-31 days =4, last
start between 32-55 days=2, last start after 55 days = 3
(f) 3yo's won in the city = 1, elsewhere = 2, placed in the city = 3, run
anywhere (without a place in the city) =4

Summary: re (F) if the runner has placed in the country =4 (harsh)
Re (B) runner at 60kg+ = 4, a runner at 59.5 would score a 1, a runner at 59
= 2, a runner at 58.5 =3.
Re (C) and (D) - it is presumed/assumed there will only be 4 or less runners
fitting the criteria? Although 6 can be catered for.
Re (E) notice the ranking for runners between 21-31 days away = 4
Re (A) It is the 4 four top trainers (however the ranking is decided) for
system 2.

System 2 used the ranking as a score line. Your runner, a contender, might
be 2 (for B), 3 (for C), 4 (for D) , 1(for E), 2(for F) which when
combined/concatenated reads as 23412.

The authors give some advice on the regularity of various combinations that
result in a dividend (a result not necessarily a win, a place, which is
again what a win is, a place - they wrote that)

Combinations run from 11111 out to 44444 - neither has been seen in 1208
results (from the essay in the booklet). Occurences/frequency are apparent
but I will leave that information aside, except combinations starting with 2
or 3 are prevalent winners (meaning placers). Importance/ability is decided
by adding the numbers (2+3+4+1+2 = 12)- lower numbers matter.

I think the score line can be improved by multiplying the elements, thereby
giving full value to 1 scores, and incremental less importance to increasing
number values. Eg 2*3*4*1*2 =48.

The systems do have names, other than #1 and #2 (it is not Surefire,
Goldrush, Super Special Bewdy - that would be a Queensland system wouldn't
it?)

Cheers

Tony




-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com




From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Sun Oct 18 21:59:46 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2020 21:59:46 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system
In-Reply-To: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>
References: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <000401d6a53d$cde58ed0$69b0ac70$@ozemail.com.au>

Tony,

Somewhat vague, 3/4 "top trainers".

With most winners?
With highest win percent?
With best return at level stake SP?
With best return to win $100 each run?

What did you understand to be the basis for ranking?

LBL


-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 20:42 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

Sometimes, (alright, mostly) you can criticise horse racing system sellers
as snake oil salespersons living in a P O Box, in some other State. 

These next two systems were offered to buyers as a 'promotion'. If you were
considered royalty, or something else, you were offered the use of the
system, and when it paid you handsomely you repaid the faith by repaying the
ownership price, 50 pounds, with instalments if you cared for that. It
wasn't a P O Box either, but you sent money orders to a street address in
Bellambi and the accounting for that was your job too, you stopped when you
sent off the last instalment for a total of the 50. Who did that? 

I paid $10 for 8 system booklets, pre-owned, which included the first
version of this system, and I presume the original owner of mine did pay his
total.

Both systems are authored by the same persons I reckon, although they are
different to a degree. Forensically!, what is exact is the results, a year
almost of expanded results, and a dissertation on 5 years operation of the
first system.

System 1: For Sydney metro racing only, races for 3yo, and/or fillies and
mares races, or fillies, or mares, up to a mile (1600m)
(a) Consider only the three top trainers and their entries in this race -
there may be multiple entries (a la Waller, say, these days) (b)Those
entries are again examined and included if they meet certain criteria
(i) weight less than 60 kg (133 pounds, 8 stones, 8 pounds) and that pounds
reference is an indicator of the systems origin in some other racing
jurisdiction, overseas somewhere.
(ii)last start finished less than 6th, second last start finished less than
6th.
(iii)contested a race within the last 56 days
(iv) it is not the favourite.

The essay on the workings of the system states that over a large number of
events the system scored 40+% winners at average odds of 4/1. Placegetters
scored 83%. 100 out 166? back.
Win betting was restricted to 9/1 or less - place betting was capped at 15/1
or less. Those figures quoted are not mine - I have tried to duplicate those
types of results for a while.

System 2: see summary for more explanations
(a) consider only the 4 top trainers and their entries this race. Score 1 -
4.
>From those contenders:
(b) weight less than 8 stones 8 pounds (60kg) Top weights 1, 2nd top weight
2 etc. Score 1 - 4
(c) last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4
(d) second last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4
(e) last start within 20 days =1, last start between 21-31 days =4, last
start between 32-55 days=2, last start after 55 days = 3
(f) 3yo's won in the city = 1, elsewhere = 2, placed in the city = 3, run
anywhere (without a place in the city) =4

Summary: re (F) if the runner has placed in the country =4 (harsh) Re (B)
runner at 60kg+ = 4, a runner at 59.5 would score a 1, a runner at 59 = 2, a
runner at 58.5 =3.
Re (C) and (D) - it is presumed/assumed there will only be 4 or less runners
fitting the criteria? Although 6 can be catered for.
Re (E) notice the ranking for runners between 21-31 days away = 4 Re (A) It
is the 4 four top trainers (however the ranking is decided) for system 2.

System 2 used the ranking as a score line. Your runner, a contender, might
be 2 (for B), 3 (for C), 4 (for D) , 1(for E), 2(for F) which when
combined/concatenated reads as 23412.

The authors give some advice on the regularity of various combinations that
result in a dividend (a result not necessarily a win, a place, which is
again what a win is, a place - they wrote that)

Combinations run from 11111 out to 44444 - neither has been seen in 1208
results (from the essay in the booklet). Occurences/frequency are apparent
but I will leave that information aside, except combinations starting with 2
or 3 are prevalent winners (meaning placers). Importance/ability is decided
by adding the numbers (2+3+4+1+2 = 12)- lower numbers matter.

I think the score line can be improved by multiplying the elements, thereby
giving full value to 1 scores, and incremental less importance to increasing
number values. Eg 2*3*4*1*2 =48.

The systems do have names, other than #1 and #2 (it is not Surefire,
Goldrush, Super Special Bewdy - that would be a Queensland system wouldn't
it?)

Cheers

Tony




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This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com


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Racing at ausrace.com
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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Sun Oct 18 22:51:21 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Sun, 18 Oct 2020 19:51:21 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system
In-Reply-To: <000401d6a53d$cde58ed0$69b0ac70$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>
	<000401d6a53d$cde58ed0$69b0ac70$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <000a01d6a544$fff60240$ffe206c0$@bigpond.com>

Len - 
The essay mentioned does have a paragraph advising that the ranking is
decided from the yearly results - TJ won a few way back and that was from
the number of winners, more than anybody.
So the leader may be that person, those with the most winners last year,
although their worthiness as a title holder, or 2nd, 3rd, or 4th would be 11
months removed at some point.

For vagueness, try Sydney metro racing, races for 3 year olds (any
distance), for fillies, for mares, for F & M out to a mile (1600m) - when
punctuation removal/replacement/substitution changes the emphasis.

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems.

The favourite is also removed as a contender, if that was the case and it
was a horse trained by the Big 4.

The system starts with the four runners (at least) of the four better
trainers (from last years results) then applies filters to those runners.
The supply and purchase of the system is novel, nearly quirky.
You paid once also, the second system was a gift. The first system book is
numbered, mine is 16, written in ink in a box on the front cover. 

Cheers


-----Original Message-----
From: Racing [mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 7:00 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

Tony,

Somewhat vague, 3/4 "top trainers".

With most winners?
With highest win percent?
With best return at level stake SP?
With best return to win $100 each run?

What did you understand to be the basis for ranking?

LBL


-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 20:42 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

Sometimes, (alright, mostly) you can criticise horse racing system sellers
as snake oil salespersons living in a P O Box, in some other State. 

These next two systems were offered to buyers as a 'promotion'. If you were
considered royalty, or something else, you were offered the use of the
system, and when it paid you handsomely you repaid the faith by repaying the
ownership price, 50 pounds, with instalments if you cared for that. It
wasn't a P O Box either, but you sent money orders to a street address in
Bellambi and the accounting for that was your job too, you stopped when you
sent off the last instalment for a total of the 50. Who did that? 

I paid $10 for 8 system booklets, pre-owned, which included the first
version of this system, and I presume the original owner of mine did pay his
total.

Both systems are authored by the same persons I reckon, although they are
different to a degree. Forensically!, what is exact is the results, a year
almost of expanded results, and a dissertation on 5 years operation of the
first system.

System 1: For Sydney metro racing only, races for 3yo, and/or fillies and
mares races, or fillies, or mares, up to a mile (1600m)
(a) Consider only the three top trainers and their entries in this race -
there may be multiple entries (a la Waller, say, these days) (b)Those
entries are again examined and included if they meet certain criteria
(i) weight less than 60 kg (133 pounds, 8 stones, 8 pounds) and that pounds
reference is an indicator of the systems origin in some other racing
jurisdiction, overseas somewhere.
(ii)last start finished less than 6th, second last start finished less than
6th.
(iii)contested a race within the last 56 days
(iv) it is not the favourite.

The essay on the workings of the system states that over a large number of
events the system scored 40+% winners at average odds of 4/1. Placegetters
scored 83%. 100 out 166? back.
Win betting was restricted to 9/1 or less - place betting was capped at 15/1
or less. Those figures quoted are not mine - I have tried to duplicate those
types of results for a while.

System 2: see summary for more explanations
(a) consider only the 4 top trainers and their entries this race. Score 1 -
4.
>From those contenders:
(b) weight less than 8 stones 8 pounds (60kg) Top weights 1, 2nd top weight
2 etc. Score 1 - 4
(c) last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4
(d) second last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4
(e) last start within 20 days =1, last start between 21-31 days =4, last
start between 32-55 days=2, last start after 55 days = 3
(f) 3yo's won in the city = 1, elsewhere = 2, placed in the city = 3, run
anywhere (without a place in the city) =4

Summary: re (F) if the runner has placed in the country =4 (harsh) Re (B)
runner at 60kg+ = 4, a runner at 59.5 would score a 1, a runner at 59 = 2, a
runner at 58.5 =3.
Re (C) and (D) - it is presumed/assumed there will only be 4 or less runners
fitting the criteria? Although 6 can be catered for.
Re (E) notice the ranking for runners between 21-31 days away = 4 Re (A) It
is the 4 four top trainers (however the ranking is decided) for system 2.

System 2 used the ranking as a score line. Your runner, a contender, might
be 2 (for B), 3 (for C), 4 (for D) , 1(for E), 2(for F) which when
combined/concatenated reads as 23412.

The authors give some advice on the regularity of various combinations that
result in a dividend (a result not necessarily a win, a place, which is
again what a win is, a place - they wrote that)

Combinations run from 11111 out to 44444 - neither has been seen in 1208
results (from the essay in the booklet). Occurences/frequency are apparent
but I will leave that information aside, except combinations starting with 2
or 3 are prevalent winners (meaning placers). Importance/ability is decided
by adding the numbers (2+3+4+1+2 = 12)- lower numbers matter.

I think the score line can be improved by multiplying the elements, thereby
giving full value to 1 scores, and incremental less importance to increasing
number values. Eg 2*3*4*1*2 =48.

The systems do have names, other than #1 and #2 (it is not Surefire,
Goldrush, Super Special Bewdy - that would be a Queensland system wouldn't
it?)

Cheers

Tony




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Racing mailing list
Racing at ausrace.com
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com


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Racing at ausrace.com
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct 19 07:52:07 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 07:52:07 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system
In-Reply-To: <000a01d6a544$fff60240$ffe206c0$@bigpond.com>
References: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>	<000401d6a53d$cde58ed0$69b0ac70$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000a01d6a544$fff60240$ffe206c0$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <001b01d6a590$920eb780$b62c2680$@ozemail.com.au>

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems

 

Tony,

 

Barriers are important; anyone else remember Victoria Park 1450m? Draw
barrier one halve the pre-draw odds; draw outside, double the pre-draw odds
- the worst bias I've come across.

 

That's history, but there are still advantages/disadvantages with barriers,
and I've not developed and used any bet-selection system that ignores them.

 

I use, but of course won't post, a system based solely on Track, Distance
and Barrier that has returned the following:

 

Last 2 years:

 

3216 selections, profit 11.1% at level stake, 10.7% at MBL

 

For Saturday only punters,

 

1052 selections, profit 17.7% at level stake, 13.9% at MBL

 

 

Last year:

 

1536 selections, profit 14.0% at level stake, 11.6% at MBL

 

For Saturday only punters,

 

479 selections, profit 28.8% at level stake, 19.8% at MBL; not large n, but
it's 9 bets a day and every little counts in today's betting climate.

 

I make it 335 tracks that were raced at in the past year, 177 of which I bet
on (335 includes Picnic meetings and the like) and calculated the figures
above from.

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 22:51 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Len -

The essay mentioned does have a paragraph advising that the ranking is
decided from the yearly results - TJ won a few way back and that was from
the number of winners, more than anybody.

So the leader may be that person, those with the most winners last year,
although their worthiness as a title holder, or 2nd, 3rd, or 4th would be 11
months removed at some point.

 

For vagueness, try Sydney metro racing, races for 3 year olds (any
distance), for fillies, for mares, for F & M out to a mile (1600m) - when
punctuation removal/replacement/substitution changes the emphasis.

 

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems.

 

The favourite is also removed as a contender, if that was the case and it
was a horse trained by the Big 4.

 

The system starts with the four runners (at least) of the four better
trainers (from last years results) then applies filters to those runners.

The supply and purchase of the system is novel, nearly quirky.

You paid once also, the second system was a gift. The first system book is
numbered, mine is 16, written in ink in a box on the front cover. 

 

Cheers

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Racing [ <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday

Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 7:00 PM

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>

Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Tony,

 

Somewhat vague, 3/4 "top trainers".

 

With most winners?

With highest win percent?

With best return at level stake SP?

With best return to win $100 each run?

 

What did you understand to be the basis for ranking?

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat

Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 20:42 PM

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>

Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Sometimes, (alright, mostly) you can criticise horse racing system sellers
as snake oil salespersons living in a P O Box, in some other State. 

 

These next two systems were offered to buyers as a 'promotion'. If you were
considered royalty, or something else, you were offered the use of the
system, and when it paid you handsomely you repaid the faith by repaying the
ownership price, 50 pounds, with instalments if you cared for that. It
wasn't a P O Box either, but you sent money orders to a street address in
Bellambi and the accounting for that was your job too, you stopped when you
sent off the last instalment for a total of the 50. Who did that? 

 

I paid $10 for 8 system booklets, pre-owned, which included the first
version of this system, and I presume the original owner of mine did pay his
total.

 

Both systems are authored by the same persons I reckon, although they are
different to a degree. Forensically!, what is exact is the results, a year
almost of expanded results, and a dissertation on 5 years operation of the
first system.

 

System 1: For Sydney metro racing only, races for 3yo, and/or fillies and
mares races, or fillies, or mares, up to a mile (1600m)

(a) Consider only the three top trainers and their entries in this race -
there may be multiple entries (a la Waller, say, these days) (b)Those
entries are again examined and included if they meet certain criteria

(i) weight less than 60 kg (133 pounds, 8 stones, 8 pounds) and that pounds
reference is an indicator of the systems origin in some other racing
jurisdiction, overseas somewhere.

(ii)last start finished less than 6th, second last start finished less than
6th.

(iii)contested a race within the last 56 days

(iv) it is not the favourite.

 

The essay on the workings of the system states that over a large number of
events the system scored 40+% winners at average odds of 4/1. Placegetters
scored 83%. 100 out 166? back.

Win betting was restricted to 9/1 or less - place betting was capped at 15/1
or less. Those figures quoted are not mine - I have tried to duplicate those
types of results for a while.

 

System 2: see summary for more explanations

(a) consider only the 4 top trainers and their entries this race. Score 1 -
4.

>From those contenders:

(b) weight less than 8 stones 8 pounds (60kg) Top weights 1, 2nd top weight

2 etc. Score 1 - 4

(c) last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4

(d) second last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4

(e) last start within 20 days =1, last start between 21-31 days =4, last
start between 32-55 days=2, last start after 55 days = 3

(f) 3yo's won in the city = 1, elsewhere = 2, placed in the city = 3, run
anywhere (without a place in the city) =4

 

Summary: re (F) if the runner has placed in the country =4 (harsh) Re (B)
runner at 60kg+ = 4, a runner at 59.5 would score a 1, a runner at 59 = 2, a
runner at 58.5 =3.

Re (C) and (D) - it is presumed/assumed there will only be 4 or less runners
fitting the criteria? Although 6 can be catered for.

Re (E) notice the ranking for runners between 21-31 days away = 4 Re (A) It
is the 4 four top trainers (however the ranking is decided) for system 2.

 

System 2 used the ranking as a score line. Your runner, a contender, might
be 2 (for B), 3 (for C), 4 (for D) , 1(for E), 2(for F) which when
combined/concatenated reads as 23412.

 

The authors give some advice on the regularity of various combinations that
result in a dividend (a result not necessarily a win, a place, which is
again what a win is, a place - they wrote that)

 

Combinations run from 11111 out to 44444 - neither has been seen in 1208
results (from the essay in the booklet). Occurences/frequency are apparent
but I will leave that information aside, except combinations starting with 2
or 3 are prevalent winners (meaning placers). Importance/ability is decided
by adding the numbers (2+3+4+1+2 = 12)- lower numbers matter.

 

I think the score line can be improved by multiplying the elements, thereby
giving full value to 1 scores, and incremental less importance to increasing
number values. Eg 2*3*4*1*2 =48.

 

The systems do have names, other than #1 and #2 (it is not Surefire,
Goldrush, Super Special Bewdy - that would be a Queensland system wouldn't

it?)

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

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 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com>
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

 

 

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 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com>
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com

 

 

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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Mon Oct 19 12:01:58 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 09:01:58 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system
In-Reply-To: <001b01d6a590$920eb780$b62c2680$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>	<000401d6a53d$cde58ed0$69b0ac70$@ozemail.com.au>	<000a01d6a544$fff60240$ffe206c0$@bigpond.com>
	<001b01d6a590$920eb780$b62c2680$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <003801d6a5b3$72a9fbc0$57fdf340$@bigpond.com>

Yeah but is the barrier effect enough to cause a result Len. Start with the
proposition that the result will be determined, or at least influenced by
how far apart they stand at the start, a mile away and back around two
turns. It can't, surely.

Or the barrier effect ceases within 100 metres of the start, and that is
conceding it has an influence, and the effect is more likely, seen more
often, down in the low numbers, the very places where there is an advantage,
if the pundits are to be believed.

 

Roger Biggs did research on this, over many runs and races, and he
determines that the barrier effect is linear, which means that at barrier 10
a runner has to make up 1 length. 

 

If you go inside, or outside barrier 10 you involve decimals and I'm not
doing that. I don't use barrier as a factor (one less thing!)

 

The barrier may cause the rider to go forward for position, not a bad thing
if position at the turn is an element in 88%? of winners, and of course the
rider can go back and depend on luck in the finish. Is that the barrier
though?

 

The barrier effect has been used by racing operatives as an excuse often or
is it real and therefore justified. 

 

Tony

 

Sent: Monday, 19 October 2020 4:52 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems

 

Tony,

 

Barriers are important; anyone else remember Victoria Park 1450m? Draw
barrier one halve the pre-draw odds; draw outside, double the pre-draw odds
- the worst bias I've come across.

 

That's history, but there are still advantages/disadvantages with barriers,
and I've not developed and used any bet-selection system that ignores them.

 

I use, but of course won't post, a system based solely on Track, Distance
and Barrier that has returned the following:

 

Last 2 years:

 

3216 selections, profit 11.1% at level stake, 10.7% at MBL

 

For Saturday only punters,

 

1052 selections, profit 17.7% at level stake, 13.9% at MBL

 

 

Last year:

 

1536 selections, profit 14.0% at level stake, 11.6% at MBL

 

For Saturday only punters,

 

479 selections, profit 28.8% at level stake, 19.8% at MBL; not large n, but
it's 9 bets a day and every little counts in today's betting climate.

 

I make it 335 tracks that were raced at in the past year, 177 of which I bet
on (335 includes Picnic meetings and the like) and calculated the figures
above from.

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 22:51 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Len -

The essay mentioned does have a paragraph advising that the ranking is
decided from the yearly results - TJ won a few way back and that was from
the number of winners, more than anybody.

So the leader may be that person, those with the most winners last year,
although their worthiness as a title holder, or 2nd, 3rd, or 4th would be 11
months removed at some point.

 

For vagueness, try Sydney metro racing, races for 3 year olds (any
distance), for fillies, for mares, for F & M out to a mile (1600m) - when
punctuation removal/replacement/substitution changes the emphasis.

 

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems.

 

The favourite is also removed as a contender, if that was the case and it
was a horse trained by the Big 4.

 

The system starts with the four runners (at least) of the four better
trainers (from last years results) then applies filters to those runners.

The supply and purchase of the system is novel, nearly quirky.

You paid once also, the second system was a gift. The first system book is
numbered, mine is 16, written in ink in a box on the front cover. 

 

Cheers

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Racing [ <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday

Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 7:00 PM

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>

Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Tony,

 

Somewhat vague, 3/4 "top trainers".

 

With most winners?

With highest win percent?

With best return at level stake SP?

With best return to win $100 each run?

 

What did you understand to be the basis for ranking?

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat

Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 20:42 PM

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>

Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Sometimes, (alright, mostly) you can criticise horse racing system sellers
as snake oil salespersons living in a P O Box, in some other State. 

 

These next two systems were offered to buyers as a 'promotion'. If you were
considered royalty, or something else, you were offered the use of the
system, and when it paid you handsomely you repaid the faith by repaying the
ownership price, 50 pounds, with instalments if you cared for that. It
wasn't a P O Box either, but you sent money orders to a street address in
Bellambi and the accounting for that was your job too, you stopped when you
sent off the last instalment for a total of the 50. Who did that? 

 

I paid $10 for 8 system booklets, pre-owned, which included the first
version of this system, and I presume the original owner of mine did pay his
total.

 

Both systems are authored by the same persons I reckon, although they are
different to a degree. Forensically!, what is exact is the results, a year
almost of expanded results, and a dissertation on 5 years operation of the
first system.

 

System 1: For Sydney metro racing only, races for 3yo, and/or fillies and
mares races, or fillies, or mares, up to a mile (1600m)

(a) Consider only the three top trainers and their entries in this race -
there may be multiple entries (a la Waller, say, these days) (b)Those
entries are again examined and included if they meet certain criteria

(i) weight less than 60 kg (133 pounds, 8 stones, 8 pounds) and that pounds
reference is an indicator of the systems origin in some other racing
jurisdiction, overseas somewhere.

(ii)last start finished less than 6th, second last start finished less than
6th.

(iii)contested a race within the last 56 days

(iv) it is not the favourite.

 

The essay on the workings of the system states that over a large number of
events the system scored 40+% winners at average odds of 4/1. Placegetters
scored 83%. 100 out 166? back.

Win betting was restricted to 9/1 or less - place betting was capped at 15/1
or less. Those figures quoted are not mine - I have tried to duplicate those
types of results for a while.

 

System 2: see summary for more explanations

(a) consider only the 4 top trainers and their entries this race. Score 1 -
4.

>From those contenders:

(b) weight less than 8 stones 8 pounds (60kg) Top weights 1, 2nd top weight

2 etc. Score 1 - 4

(c) last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4

(d) second last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4

(e) last start within 20 days =1, last start between 21-31 days =4, last
start between 32-55 days=2, last start after 55 days = 3

(f) 3yo's won in the city = 1, elsewhere = 2, placed in the city = 3, run
anywhere (without a place in the city) =4

 

Summary: re (F) if the runner has placed in the country =4 (harsh) Re (B)
runner at 60kg+ = 4, a runner at 59.5 would score a 1, a runner at 59 = 2, a
runner at 58.5 =3.

Re (C) and (D) - it is presumed/assumed there will only be 4 or less runners
fitting the criteria? Although 6 can be catered for.

Re (E) notice the ranking for runners between 21-31 days away = 4 Re (A) It
is the 4 four top trainers (however the ranking is decided) for system 2.

 

System 2 used the ranking as a score line. Your runner, a contender, might
be 2 (for B), 3 (for C), 4 (for D) , 1(for E), 2(for F) which when
combined/concatenated reads as 23412.

 

The authors give some advice on the regularity of various combinations that
result in a dividend (a result not necessarily a win, a place, which is
again what a win is, a place - they wrote that)

 

Combinations run from 11111 out to 44444 - neither has been seen in 1208
results (from the essay in the booklet). Occurences/frequency are apparent
but I will leave that information aside, except combinations starting with 2
or 3 are prevalent winners (meaning placers). Importance/ability is decided
by adding the numbers (2+3+4+1+2 = 12)- lower numbers matter.

 

I think the score line can be improved by multiplying the elements, thereby
giving full value to 1 scores, and incremental less importance to increasing
number values. Eg 2*3*4*1*2 =48.

 

The systems do have names, other than #1 and #2 (it is not Surefire,
Goldrush, Super Special Bewdy - that would be a Queensland system wouldn't

it?)

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct 19 13:48:00 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 19 Oct 2020 13:48:00 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system
In-Reply-To: <003801d6a5b3$72a9fbc0$57fdf340$@bigpond.com>
References: <000a01d6a532$e0af9700$a20ec500$@bigpond.com>	<000401d6a53d$cde58ed0$69b0ac70$@ozemail.com.au>	<000a01d6a544$fff60240$ffe206c0$@bigpond.com>	<001b01d6a590$920eb780$b62c2680$@ozemail.com.au>
	<003801d6a5b3$72a9fbc0$57fdf340$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <003201d6a5c2$444b43b0$cce1cb10$@ozemail.com.au>

My figures are real, the basis makes sense TO ME, and I have used very large
numbers - I don't go beyond three things, positive betting expectations,
large numbers and my common sense. 

 

Roger Biggs did research on this, over many runs and races, and he
determines that the barrier effect is linear, which means that at barrier 10
a runner has to make up 1 length

 

I did research on over 5,000,000 runs (and I use my results to bet with, not
to flog). The above is far too simplistic - at barrier 10 a runner has to
make up the same 1 length whether down the old Victoria Park straight 5 or
over 1450m at the same course where the barrier was just before the first of
2 bends and "everyone" knew barrier was all-important?! It is, in my
opinion, nonsense to suggest that track and distance does not affect the
effect of barrier. My calculated Impact Values of barriers at various Track
and Distances were a Maximum of 2.19, a Minimum of 0.56. And that is
massive. 

 

Lump them all together as if all tracks and distances are the same, and
looking only at fields of exactly 10, Impact Value of Barrier 1 is 1.15, of
Barrier 10 is 0.92, vastly different from looking at each track and distance
individually. 

 

Impact Value of leading at the turn (from TRB positions, don't know where
they source them) 2.51; of being last at turn 0.21. Who wouldn't love to get
on at SP at the home turn?

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Monday, 19 October 2020 12:02 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Yeah but is the barrier effect enough to cause a result Len. Start with the
proposition that the result will be determined, or at least influenced by
how far apart they stand at the start, a mile away and back around two
turns. It can't, surely.

Or the barrier effect ceases within 100 metres of the start, and that is
conceding it has an influence, and the effect is more likely, seen more
often, down in the low numbers, the very places where there is an advantage,
if the pundits are to be believed.

 

Roger Biggs did research on this, over many runs and races, and he
determines that the barrier effect is linear, which means that at barrier 10
a runner has to make up 1 length. 

 

If you go inside, or outside barrier 10 you involve decimals and I'm not
doing that. I don't use barrier as a factor (one less thing!)

 

The barrier may cause the rider to go forward for position, not a bad thing
if position at the turn is an element in 88%? of winners, and of course the
rider can go back and depend on luck in the finish. Is that the barrier
though?

 

The barrier effect has been used by racing operatives as an excuse often or
is it real and therefore justified. 

 

Tony

 

Sent: Monday, 19 October 2020 4:52 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems

 

Tony,

 

Barriers are important; anyone else remember Victoria Park 1450m? Draw
barrier one halve the pre-draw odds; draw outside, double the pre-draw odds
- the worst bias I've come across.

 

That's history, but there are still advantages/disadvantages with barriers,
and I've not developed and used any bet-selection system that ignores them.

 

I use, but of course won't post, a system based solely on Track, Distance
and Barrier that has returned the following:

 

Last 2 years:

 

3216 selections, profit 11.1% at level stake, 10.7% at MBL

 

For Saturday only punters,

 

1052 selections, profit 17.7% at level stake, 13.9% at MBL

 

 

Last year:

 

1536 selections, profit 14.0% at level stake, 11.6% at MBL

 

For Saturday only punters,

 

479 selections, profit 28.8% at level stake, 19.8% at MBL; not large n, but
it's 9 bets a day and every little counts in today's betting climate.

 

I make it 335 tracks that were raced at in the past year, 177 of which I bet
on (335 includes Picnic meetings and the like) and calculated the figures
above from.

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 22:51 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Len -

The essay mentioned does have a paragraph advising that the ranking is
decided from the yearly results - TJ won a few way back and that was from
the number of winners, more than anybody.

So the leader may be that person, those with the most winners last year,
although their worthiness as a title holder, or 2nd, 3rd, or 4th would be 11
months removed at some point.

 

For vagueness, try Sydney metro racing, races for 3 year olds (any
distance), for fillies, for mares, for F & M out to a mile (1600m) - when
punctuation removal/replacement/substitution changes the emphasis.

 

There is no involvement of barrier position, this is often an aspect of
systems.

 

The favourite is also removed as a contender, if that was the case and it
was a horse trained by the Big 4.

 

The system starts with the four runners (at least) of the four better
trainers (from last years results) then applies filters to those runners.

The supply and purchase of the system is novel, nearly quirky.

You paid once also, the second system was a gift. The first system book is
numbered, mine is 16, written in ink in a box on the front cover. 

 

Cheers

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Racing [ <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday

Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 7:00 PM

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>

Subject: Re: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Tony,

 

Somewhat vague, 3/4 "top trainers".

 

With most winners?

With highest win percent?

With best return at level stake SP?

With best return to win $100 each run?

 

What did you understand to be the basis for ranking?

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----

From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat

Sent: Sunday, 18 October 2020 20:42 PM

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' < <mailto:racing at ausrace.com>
racing at ausrace.com>

Subject: [AusRace] System 1 and System 2 - a system

 

Sometimes, (alright, mostly) you can criticise horse racing system sellers
as snake oil salespersons living in a P O Box, in some other State. 

 

These next two systems were offered to buyers as a 'promotion'. If you were
considered royalty, or something else, you were offered the use of the
system, and when it paid you handsomely you repaid the faith by repaying the
ownership price, 50 pounds, with instalments if you cared for that. It
wasn't a P O Box either, but you sent money orders to a street address in
Bellambi and the accounting for that was your job too, you stopped when you
sent off the last instalment for a total of the 50. Who did that? 

 

I paid $10 for 8 system booklets, pre-owned, which included the first
version of this system, and I presume the original owner of mine did pay his
total.

 

Both systems are authored by the same persons I reckon, although they are
different to a degree. Forensically!, what is exact is the results, a year
almost of expanded results, and a dissertation on 5 years operation of the
first system.

 

System 1: For Sydney metro racing only, races for 3yo, and/or fillies and
mares races, or fillies, or mares, up to a mile (1600m)

(a) Consider only the three top trainers and their entries in this race -
there may be multiple entries (a la Waller, say, these days) (b)Those
entries are again examined and included if they meet certain criteria

(i) weight less than 60 kg (133 pounds, 8 stones, 8 pounds) and that pounds
reference is an indicator of the systems origin in some other racing
jurisdiction, overseas somewhere.

(ii)last start finished less than 6th, second last start finished less than
6th.

(iii)contested a race within the last 56 days

(iv) it is not the favourite.

 

The essay on the workings of the system states that over a large number of
events the system scored 40+% winners at average odds of 4/1. Placegetters
scored 83%. 100 out 166? back.

Win betting was restricted to 9/1 or less - place betting was capped at 15/1
or less. Those figures quoted are not mine - I have tried to duplicate those
types of results for a while.

 

System 2: see summary for more explanations

(a) consider only the 4 top trainers and their entries this race. Score 1 -
4.

>From those contenders:

(b) weight less than 8 stones 8 pounds (60kg) Top weights 1, 2nd top weight

2 etc. Score 1 - 4

(c) last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4

(d) second last start finished less than 6th - Rank the finish 1-4

(e) last start within 20 days =1, last start between 21-31 days =4, last
start between 32-55 days=2, last start after 55 days = 3

(f) 3yo's won in the city = 1, elsewhere = 2, placed in the city = 3, run
anywhere (without a place in the city) =4

 

Summary: re (F) if the runner has placed in the country =4 (harsh) Re (B)
runner at 60kg+ = 4, a runner at 59.5 would score a 1, a runner at 59 = 2, a
runner at 58.5 =3.

Re (C) and (D) - it is presumed/assumed there will only be 4 or less runners
fitting the criteria? Although 6 can be catered for.

Re (E) notice the ranking for runners between 21-31 days away = 4 Re (A) It
is the 4 four top trainers (however the ranking is decided) for system 2.

 

System 2 used the ranking as a score line. Your runner, a contender, might
be 2 (for B), 3 (for C), 4 (for D) , 1(for E), 2(for F) which when
combined/concatenated reads as 23412.

 

The authors give some advice on the regularity of various combinations that
result in a dividend (a result not necessarily a win, a place, which is
again what a win is, a place - they wrote that)

 

Combinations run from 11111 out to 44444 - neither has been seen in 1208
results (from the essay in the booklet). Occurences/frequency are apparent
but I will leave that information aside, except combinations starting with 2
or 3 are prevalent winners (meaning placers). Importance/ability is decided
by adding the numbers (2+3+4+1+2 = 12)- lower numbers matter.

 

I think the score line can be improved by multiplying the elements, thereby
giving full value to 1 scores, and incremental less importance to increasing
number values. Eg 2*3*4*1*2 =48.

 

The systems do have names, other than #1 and #2 (it is not Surefire,
Goldrush, Super Special Bewdy - that would be a Queensland system wouldn't

it?)

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

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 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com>
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From robbie at robbiewaterhouse.com  Wed Oct 21 11:11:02 2020
From: robbie at robbiewaterhouse.com (Robbie Waterhouse)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2020 11:11:02 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm e3399e0185b4fd22edeba0066584c02a4cd4c172
In-Reply-To: <mailman.7.1603231204.2611867.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
References: <mailman.7.1603231204.2611867.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
Message-ID: <04df01d6a73e$a995dc30$fcc19490$@robbiewaterhouse.com>

Is this safe?

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of
racing-request at ausrace.com
Sent: Wednesday, 21 October 2020 9:00 AM
To: robbie at robbiewaterhouse.com
Subject: confirm e3399e0185b4fd22edeba0066584c02a4cd4c172

Your membership in the mailing list Racing has been disabled due to
excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated 07-Oct-2020.
You will not get any more messages from this list until you re-enable your
membership.  You will receive 1 more reminders like this before your
membership in the list is deleted.

To re-enable your membership, you can simply respond to this message
(leaving the Subject: line intact), or visit the confirmation page at

 
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You can also visit your membership page at

 
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct 21 11:45:17 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2020 11:45:17 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm e3399e0185b4fd22edeba0066584c02a4cd4c172
In-Reply-To: <04df01d6a73e$a995dc30$fcc19490$@robbiewaterhouse.com>
References: <mailman.7.1603231204.2611867.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>
	<04df01d6a73e$a995dc30$fcc19490$@robbiewaterhouse.com>
Message-ID: <007701d6a743$740f1040$5c2d30c0$@ozemail.com.au>

Yes, at least it was for me.


-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Robbie Waterhouse
Sent: Wednesday, 21 October 2020 11:11 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] FW: confirm e3399e0185b4fd22edeba0066584c02a4cd4c172

Is this safe?

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of
racing-request at ausrace.com
Sent: Wednesday, 21 October 2020 9:00 AM
To: robbie at robbiewaterhouse.com
Subject: confirm e3399e0185b4fd22edeba0066584c02a4cd4c172

Your membership in the mailing list Racing has been disabled due to
excessive bounces The last bounce received from you was dated 07-Oct-2020.
You will not get any more messages from this list until you re-enable your
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To re-enable your membership, you can simply respond to this message
(leaving the Subject: line intact), or visit the confirmation page at

 
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You can also visit your membership page at

 
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On your membership page, you can change various delivery options such as
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct 21 12:03:58 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2020 12:03:58 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Classic Bet
Message-ID: <008401d6a746$111b9d20$3352d760$@ozemail.com.au>

 

Quote:  New players or not they are ALL tarred with the same brush.....

 

Comment on this Ken?

 



 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: ausrace-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:ausrace-bounces at ausrace.com>  On
Behalf Of Ken Blake
Sent: Friday, 4 September 2015 9:27 AM
To: ausrace at ausrace.com <mailto:ausrace at ausrace.com> 
Subject: [AusRace] Classic Bet

 

Len.......You are an A grade Masochist.....why do you torture yourself with
these ongoing interactions with the corporate sector.

 

 

 

New players or not they are ALL tarred with the same brush.....

 

 

 

 

 

You summed it up perfectly " Gutless, incompetent, dishonest - they should
preface their advertisements with "We welcome compulsive gamblers,
desperates trying to gamble their way out of poverty, and those with mental
illnesses. 

 

If there is a chance you may win, don't waste your time; we won't accept
your business.

 

 

 

There is an on course / online bookmaker here in W.A. .....PUNTA

 

 

 

They display liabilities of each runner at the that particular price in
'amount available' similar to Betfair......

 

 

 

>From their website: Unlike your typical online bookmaker, we're listening.

We want to know the price you're after for the bet you want.

 

Punters betting with PUNTA Bookmaking have the ability to request a price
for any given runner on a featured meeting. All requests are considered,
whilst reasonably sized and priced bets are more likely to be approved. For
example; $100 at the requested price of $7 rather, than at the displayed
price of $6.50.

 

PUNTA also displays the 'amount available' at the price on offer. This aims
to reduce frustration in being transparent on how much is able to be bet up
front. Once the amount on offer has been consumed, the price on offer will
reduce and the limits will be reset.

 

Bets at the displayed price and within normal betting limits will
automatically be approved.

 

If you have any questions regarding the operation of any of the above,

 

 

 

 

 

So it doesn't matter if you've won thousands for weeks on end there is no
account closure here.......you can bet what is available.

 

 

 

....this is a step in the right direction and if somebody had any balls in
the administrative side of wagering they would make this mandatory across
the wagering sector.

 

 

 

.....under the current umbrella the Corporate sector is a  wagering industry
cancer.

 

 

 

Unfortunately PUNTA only operates on local W.A racing.              

 

 

 

 

 

_______________________________________________

AusRace mailing list

 <mailto:AusRace at ausrace.com> AusRace at ausrace.com

 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/ausrace>
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/ausrace

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From conceptracing at bigpond.com  Wed Oct 21 15:16:41 2020
From: conceptracing at bigpond.com (Ken Blake)
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 2020 12:16:41 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Classic Bet
In-Reply-To: <008401d6a746$111b9d20$3352d760$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <008401d6a746$111b9d20$3352d760$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <000001d6a760$fb688b80$f239a280$@bigpond.com>

Len.perhaps you have dialogue with some of these people.   Literally
hundreds of complaints against this mob..I actually got tired of scrolling
down plus the rising blood pressure.

 

Don't ever use sports bet. They scammed my money. There was one time I get
on a table tennis match and the finished result is a win but they counted it
as a loss. Tried to call their customer service which I had to wait for
almost an hour and said they will get back to me after 48 hours. But after a
week they told me that the it was a loss even after proving my bet receipt
with the correct live score from sofa score! They told me I bet on a match
that happened an hour earlier.. so they were trying to tell me that I went
back in time an hour earlier to bet. The worse of all, even after I told
them I watched the matched live and placed a live betting.. They still told
me that they are not gonna do anything about it because they say it's a
loss.. scammmmmmmmmmm....

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5f800032798e6f0784a92340> They change
the fixed odds post-bet

Placed a fixed odds bet paying 5/1. Horse won, they paid out 3/1. "Live
chat" took 40 minutes for a response, then they disconnect. Absolute
scam-artists. F*** you, Sportsbet.

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5f5ceed302e8570acc36971d> I used bonus
bet

I used bonus bet, no scratchings from acceptance of my bet, underpaid $175.
Worst service ever!!! Three phone calls to 24/7 hotline, one at 1.25am(!)
got the same pre-recorded runaround-90 mins wasted. Three emails. Not a
peep. I've used other betting services, never a problem. This one is the
pits!

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5f59878902e8570becb241c4> Sportsbet took
over beteasy

Sportsbet took over beteasy, so I download the app, Placed 2 bets on the
doggies, trifecta and first 4 same race, received the payout for the
trifecta but not the first 4, both say "won", numbers were right, chat
messaged them, Georgia first tells me I never boxed the bet (which clearly
was) then tells me the winnings didn't cover the bet, then get told it
wasn't a multi bet ... So 1.5 hours later getting passed around. Rip offs,
enjoy the Xmas pissup at my expense, photos uploading to media as I write
this review.

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5eec3cc87dd7530324704683> I joined 2
weeks ago and I have since.

I joined 2 weeks ago and I have since LOST $820.00 to Sportsbet - so they
are well in front. I only bet $1550.00 so a 50% loss in significant.

Sportsbet now tell me I have been cutoff from future promotions AND CANNOT
TELL ME WHY - they say the matter is out of their hands.

Despite my very concerned protestations nobody on their so called CUSTOMER
SERVICE line was able to help - I was told that other parties had made that
decision !!

DO NOT TRUST SPORTSBET

I am rightly annoyed and AT LEAST worthy of some respect in relation

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5e9be0b9086b6409bc87e59a> I placed a
fixed price bet on Lanken.

I placed a fixed price bet on Lanken Star at 44 to 1 Caulfield on the
15/04/2020. $2200.00 result.
On the 18/04/2020 there were four scratchings. I took a screen shot of the
scratchings, no deductions
I also checked Beteasy, TAB, and Ladbrokes they also notified no deductions
I also had two friends place a bet on Lanken Star with Ladbrokes and Betesy
at fixed odds, there were no deductions taken from there bet.
I contacted SPORTSBET to ask why they deducted $550.00 from my bet when
there were no deductions notified after the scratchings on saturday their
reply was sorry the deductions stand.
Sportsbet are not a reputable company to bet with, when they moved the go

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5e6df8453c93ae091808275d> Joke
company.They advertise "a punter.

Joke company.They advertise "a punter had $10,000" on a horse or footy game
yet you try and have a couple of hundred and they take a partial bet of $30
or so .Full of rubbish! Overseas BS artist.

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5e59fbfc3c93ae0bc40ca395> SportsBet is a
literal SCAM

SportsBet is a literal SCAM. They will adjust the descriptions of bets after
you have placed them and they will manipulate the results of bets against
documented factual outcomes in order to resolve a bet in their favour.

Customer support is arrogant and couldn't care less about retaining your
business. One of the worst SCAM companies I've ever seen.

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5def4da41ef7dca7afdc5b17> 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5def4da41ef7dca7afdc5b17> 



 

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5e59fae6878feef7a4caadcd> 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5e59fae6878feef7a4caadcd> 



 

 

 

 

 

 

  <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5ee35358e0be995f5f77a095> 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5ee35358e0be995f5f77a095> 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5f5c40b1397ac29c5ac93d5f> 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5f5c40b1397ac29c5ac93d5f> 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2020 9:04 AM
To: racing at ausrace.com
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Classic Bet

 

 

Quote:  New players or not they are ALL tarred with the same brush.....

 

Comment on this Ken?

 



 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: ausrace-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:ausrace-bounces at ausrace.com>  On
Behalf Of Ken Blake
Sent: Friday, 4 September 2015 9:27 AM
To: ausrace at ausrace.com <mailto:ausrace at ausrace.com> 
Subject: [AusRace] Classic Bet

 

Len.......You are an A grade Masochist.....why do you torture yourself with
these ongoing interactions with the corporate sector.

 

 

 

New players or not they are ALL tarred with the same brush.....

 

 

 

 

 

You summed it up perfectly " Gutless, incompetent, dishonest - they should
preface their advertisements with "We welcome compulsive gamblers,
desperates trying to gamble their way out of poverty, and those with mental
illnesses. 

 

If there is a chance you may win, don't waste your time; we won't accept
your business.

 

 

 

There is an on course / online bookmaker here in W.A. .....PUNTA

 

 

 

They display liabilities of each runner at the that particular price in
'amount available' similar to Betfair......

 

 

 

>From their website: Unlike your typical online bookmaker, we're listening.

We want to know the price you're after for the bet you want.

 

Punters betting with PUNTA Bookmaking have the ability to request a price
for any given runner on a featured meeting. All requests are considered,
whilst reasonably sized and priced bets are more likely to be approved. For
example; $100 at the requested price of $7 rather, than at the displayed
price of $6.50.

 

PUNTA also displays the 'amount available' at the price on offer. This aims
to reduce frustration in being transparent on how much is able to be bet up
front. Once the amount on offer has been consumed, the price on offer will
reduce and the limits will be reset.

 

Bets at the displayed price and within normal betting limits will
automatically be approved.

 

If you have any questions regarding the operation of any of the above,

 

 

 

 

 

So it doesn't matter if you've won thousands for weeks on end there is no
account closure here.......you can bet what is available.

 

 

 

....this is a step in the right direction and if somebody had any balls in
the administrative side of wagering they would make this mandatory across
the wagering sector.

 

 

 

.....under the current umbrella the Corporate sector is a  wagering industry
cancer.

 

 

 

Unfortunately PUNTA only operates on local W.A racing.              

 

 

 

 

 

_______________________________________________

AusRace mailing list

 <mailto:AusRace at ausrace.com> AusRace at ausrace.com

 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/ausrace>
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/ausrace

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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Fri Oct 23 01:27:02 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Thu, 22 Oct 2020 22:27:02 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
Message-ID: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>


Fitness -The Key to Winning
Barry J Blakemore wrote a series of horse racing form study books. 
I have contacted the author and obtained his permission to quote from his
books
Copyright Barrymore Publications - PO Box 673 BUDERIM Queensland 4556
Thank you Mr Blakemore Ref 07 5476***2 

"Fitness -The Key to Winning" 1993 (56 pages) says this:-
52% winning runners (from multiple runners) when runners conform with an
exposed frequency, when runners start within a few days of a previous run
their winning chances improve, markedly - I did not know that and it's in
the book. Yes it is specific and applicable to a select group but it is a
powerful stat and one that is repeated over various distances of races.
The author uses FITNESS PATTERNS to show and explain the likely capability
of horses generally, and specifically, if runners have attributes shown to
enable them to win, run above expectations, or tire and lose.
Runners, and their re-appearance at the races are categorized (simplified)
as thus, these are the FITNESS PATTERNS
1 to 9 days - simplified to 7 days
10 to 17 days - simplified to 14 days
18 to 24 days - simplified to 21 days
On up to
39 to 45 days - simplified to 42 days
Horses running on or after the 46th day are considered to be first up. First
up is a bonus. There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called
results) that shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated,
more than their share, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit
for.
An example of how the book shows us FITNESS PATTERNS - a runner with 9 days
until its next run, then another run on the 19th day along until a third run
on the 39th day in is shown as 9/19/39 which simplifies to 35/21/7 ( see
above). Runs before the 9th day appearance are disregarded, considered to be
too far back in the form score to affect its endeavours now.     
The author then divides races into divisions (1000/1100m- 1200m-1300/1400m,
1500/1600m, etc. until races over 2100m+  are dealt with as a large group.
Nonetheless, within those divisions there are FITNESS PATTERNS/niches that
have percentage scores way over and above other PATTERNS around them.  
So in each race you have runners who had their last starts some days ago,
varying, and those gaps in the days have a value that increases, or
decreases, dependent on the time gap, and also affected by the distance of
the race to be contested. The authors research has shown, or revealed,
niches where runners are more likely to prove competitive, or importantly,
when and where they can be discounted as possibilities. Sprinters need time
to recuperate, distance runners need racing to keep them ticking along,
first uppers over sprint distances are dynamite (I said that), 3 runs in 31
days can be a good thing, or a bad thing, a great thing or an occasion when
a judgement is required - it's in the book.
Further reviews of the authors other books will be posted soon.
The Key Factor is Fitness 1997 - Barrymore Publications
The Key Factor is Fitness  - The System 1997 82 pages - Barrymore
Publications
The Secrets of Class and other Key Factors 2000 180 pages - Barrymore
Publications
The Secrets of Class - The System 2001 -80 pages - Barrymore Publications
Weights Right 2004 136 pages - Barrymore Publications
These publications are an intellectual investment in winner finding, horse
racing generally, honest and earnest reasoning regarding the punt. The
Secrets of Class (both) are well researched and well written. The same can
be said of Weights Right. The others are a little dated. All books hold true
to the method(s) written about in The Key Factor is Fitness. They are all
out of print.
Thank you Mr Blakemore

Cheers

Tony




-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com




From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Fri Oct 23 12:25:20 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Fri, 23 Oct 2020 12:25:20 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Classic Bet
In-Reply-To: <000001d6a760$fb688b80$f239a280$@bigpond.com>
References: <008401d6a746$111b9d20$3352d760$@ozemail.com.au>
	<000001d6a760$fb688b80$f239a280$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <002601d6a8db$612b7330$23825990$@ozemail.com.au>

I take very little, usually no, notice of comments from people I don't know.
I judge bookmarkers solely on my dealings with them.

 

I regard bookmakers as conduits/middlemen to transfer money between other
punters and me (sort of like BetFair without 10% commission). Other punters
are, for me, my opponents, not bookmakers. May the hardest workers prosper. 

 

When I bet in the Morphettville Auditorium, we used to drink together on
occasions when the betting was done, on a few occasions venture down to
Glenelg for a meal. 

 

On course I told Webster, Thornton and Churches (maybe only NorSaint will
remember them) that they got an odds wrong - "I'll have $1000 #6 if you're
serious Steve", he whipped the slide across, "No, I'm not serious".
"Thanks", said John, "I don't need a leg-up", "I think you'd do the same
even if you did". Other punters did not like it, but they were my opponents,
I was not seeking their friendship or approval. Having difficulty
reconciling my bets with Ron Bannear's staff - "Just pay Lenny whatever he
says" said Bannear.

 

In Sydney after Randwick, we'd retire to the War Memorial Club, Wayne
McDonald, assorted bookmaker/TAB/Luxbet staff and a punter. The young would
make their lines to McDonald's daughter (a stunner) and I'd recognise my
limitations and drink/talk.

 

Yes, I post here warnings about the crooks, but as long as others
(Sportsbet, TAB, TopSport, B365, Sportsbetting notably) are willing/forced
to afford me wine, women and song, c'est la vie! Nothing more, just enough
to live pleasantly month-to-month - if Biden wins and China annexes
Australia, I'm a gonna.

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of Ken Blake
Sent: Wednesday, 21 October 2020 15:17 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Classic Bet

 

Len.perhaps you have dialogue with some of these people.   Literally
hundreds of complaints against this mob..I actually got tired of scrolling
down plus the rising blood pressure.

 

Don't ever use sports bet. They scammed my money. There was one time I get
on a table tennis match and the finished result is a win but they counted it
as a loss. Tried to call their customer service which I had to wait for
almost an hour and said they will get back to me after 48 hours. But after a
week they told me that the it was a loss even after proving my bet receipt
with the correct live score from sofa score! They told me I bet on a match
that happened an hour earlier.. so they were trying to tell me that I went
back in time an hour earlier to bet. The worse of all, even after I told
them I watched the matched live and placed a live betting.. They still told
me that they are not gonna do anything about it because they say it's a
loss.. scammmmmmmmmmm....

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5f800032798e6f0784a92340> They change
the fixed odds post-bet

Placed a fixed odds bet paying 5/1. Horse won, they paid out 3/1. "Live
chat" took 40 minutes for a response, then they disconnect. Absolute
scam-artists. F*** you, Sportsbet.

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5f5ceed302e8570acc36971d> I used bonus
bet

I used bonus bet, no scratchings from acceptance of my bet, underpaid $175.
Worst service ever!!! Three phone calls to 24/7 hotline, one at 1.25am(!)
got the same pre-recorded runaround-90 mins wasted. Three emails. Not a
peep. I've used other betting services, never a problem. This one is the
pits!

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5f59878902e8570becb241c4> Sportsbet took
over beteasy

Sportsbet took over beteasy, so I download the app, Placed 2 bets on the
doggies, trifecta and first 4 same race, received the payout for the
trifecta but not the first 4, both say "won", numbers were right, chat
messaged them, Georgia first tells me I never boxed the bet (which clearly
was) then tells me the winnings didn't cover the bet, then get told it
wasn't a multi bet ... So 1.5 hours later getting passed around. Rip offs,
enjoy the Xmas pissup at my expense, photos uploading to media as I write
this review.

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5eec3cc87dd7530324704683> I joined 2
weeks ago and I have since.

I joined 2 weeks ago and I have since LOST $820.00 to Sportsbet - so they
are well in front. I only bet $1550.00 so a 50% loss in significant.

Sportsbet now tell me I have been cutoff from future promotions AND CANNOT
TELL ME WHY - they say the matter is out of their hands.

Despite my very concerned protestations nobody on their so called CUSTOMER
SERVICE line was able to help - I was told that other parties had made that
decision !!

DO NOT TRUST SPORTSBET

I am rightly annoyed and AT LEAST worthy of some respect in relation

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5e9be0b9086b6409bc87e59a> I placed a
fixed price bet on Lanken.

I placed a fixed price bet on Lanken Star at 44 to 1 Caulfield on the
15/04/2020. $2200.00 result.
On the 18/04/2020 there were four scratchings. I took a screen shot of the
scratchings, no deductions
I also checked Beteasy, TAB, and Ladbrokes they also notified no deductions
I also had two friends place a bet on Lanken Star with Ladbrokes and Betesy
at fixed odds, there were no deductions taken from there bet.
I contacted SPORTSBET to ask why they deducted $550.00 from my bet when
there were no deductions notified after the scratchings on saturday their
reply was sorry the deductions stand.
Sportsbet are not a reputable company to bet with, when they moved the go

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5e6df8453c93ae091808275d> Joke
company.They advertise "a punter.

Joke company.They advertise "a punter had $10,000" on a horse or footy game
yet you try and have a couple of hundred and they take a partial bet of $30
or so .Full of rubbish! Overseas BS artist.

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/reviews/5e59fbfc3c93ae0bc40ca395> SportsBet is a
literal SCAM

SportsBet is a literal SCAM. They will adjust the descriptions of bets after
you have placed them and they will manipulate the results of bets against
documented factual outcomes in order to resolve a bet in their favour.

Customer support is arrogant and couldn't care less about retaining your
business. One of the worst SCAM companies I've ever seen.

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5def4da41ef7dca7afdc5b17> 



 

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5e59fae6878feef7a4caadcd> 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5ee35358e0be995f5f77a095> 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 <https://au.trustpilot.com/users/5f5c40b1397ac29c5ac93d5f> 



 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com>
> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, October 21, 2020 9:04 AM
To: racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> 
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Classic Bet

 

 

Quote:  New players or not they are ALL tarred with the same brush.....

 

Comment on this Ken?

 



 

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: ausrace-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:ausrace-bounces at ausrace.com>  On
Behalf Of Ken Blake
Sent: Friday, 4 September 2015 9:27 AM
To: ausrace at ausrace.com <mailto:ausrace at ausrace.com> 
Subject: [AusRace] Classic Bet

 

Len.......You are an A grade Masochist.....why do you torture yourself with
these ongoing interactions with the corporate sector.

 

 

 

New players or not they are ALL tarred with the same brush.....

 

 

 

 

 

You summed it up perfectly " Gutless, incompetent, dishonest - they should
preface their advertisements with "We welcome compulsive gamblers,
desperates trying to gamble their way out of poverty, and those with mental
illnesses. 

 

If there is a chance you may win, don't waste your time; we won't accept
your business.

 

 

 

There is an on course / online bookmaker here in W.A. .....PUNTA

 

 

 

They display liabilities of each runner at the that particular price in
'amount available' similar to Betfair......

 

 

 

>From their website: Unlike your typical online bookmaker, we're listening.

We want to know the price you're after for the bet you want.

 

Punters betting with PUNTA Bookmaking have the ability to request a price
for any given runner on a featured meeting. All requests are considered,
whilst reasonably sized and priced bets are more likely to be approved. For
example; $100 at the requested price of $7 rather, than at the displayed
price of $6.50.

 

PUNTA also displays the 'amount available' at the price on offer. This aims
to reduce frustration in being transparent on how much is able to be bet up
front. Once the amount on offer has been consumed, the price on offer will
reduce and the limits will be reset.

 

Bets at the displayed price and within normal betting limits will
automatically be approved.

 

If you have any questions regarding the operation of any of the above,

 

 

 

 

 

So it doesn't matter if you've won thousands for weeks on end there is no
account closure here.......you can bet what is available.

 

 

 

....this is a step in the right direction and if somebody had any balls in
the administrative side of wagering they would make this mandatory across
the wagering sector.

 

 

 

.....under the current umbrella the Corporate sector is a  wagering industry
cancer.

 

 

 

Unfortunately PUNTA only operates on local W.A racing.              

 

 

 

 

 

_______________________________________________

AusRace mailing list

 <mailto:AusRace at ausrace.com> AusRace at ausrace.com

 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/ausrace>
http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/ausrace

-------------- next part --------------
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Mon Oct 26 10:47:11 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2020 10:47:11 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
In-Reply-To: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>
References: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>

Tony,

 

He got this wrong, at least in the context of Australian Thoroughbred races:

 

There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called results) that
shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated, ****more than
their share****, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit for.

 

Wrong, unconditionally wrong.

 

I analysed 190,000+ first-uppers (excluding first-starters) in field of 8 or
more (so I can also compare Place performance, which I mostly bet), in races
I have rated since 2005.

 

First Ups win (and place) very significantly less than their share - 8.6%,
25.8% cf 9.3%, 28.1% for all runners, and significantly less than 2nd up
(9.0, 26.9), and even more so than 3rd up (10.0, 29.3). Quickly, why are
there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than 2nd ups?

 

However, the market factors in the well-know (well I thought so) fact that
first ups win much less than their share, and so the level stake return at
SP of first ups is not significantly different to that of all runners.

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Friday, 23 October 2020 1:27 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

 

Fitness -The Key to Winning

Barry J Blakemore wrote a series of horse racing form study books. 

I have contacted the author and obtained his permission to quote from his
books Copyright Barrymore Publications - PO Box 673 BUDERIM Queensland 4556
Thank you Mr Blakemore Ref 07 5476***2 

 

"Fitness -The Key to Winning" 1993 (56 pages) says this:- 52% winning
runners (from multiple runners) when runners conform with an exposed
frequency, when runners start within a few days of a previous run their
winning chances improve, markedly - I did not know that and it's in the
book. Yes it is specific and applicable to a select group but it is a
powerful stat and one that is repeated over various distances of races.

The author uses FITNESS PATTERNS to show and explain the likely capability
of horses generally, and specifically, if runners have attributes shown to
enable them to win, run above expectations, or tire and lose.

Runners, and their re-appearance at the races are categorized (simplified)
as thus, these are the FITNESS PATTERNS

1 to 9 days - simplified to 7 days

10 to 17 days - simplified to 14 days

18 to 24 days - simplified to 21 days

On up to

39 to 45 days - simplified to 42 days

Horses running on or after the 46th day are considered to be first up. First
up is a bonus. There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called

results) that shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated,
more than their share, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit
for.

An example of how the book shows us FITNESS PATTERNS - a runner with 9 days
until its next run, then another run on the 19th day along until a third run
on the 39th day in is shown as 9/19/39 which simplifies to 35/21/7 ( see
above). Runs before the 9th day appearance are disregarded, considered to be

too far back in the form score to affect its endeavours now.     

The author then divides races into divisions (1000/1100m- 1200m-1300/1400m,
1500/1600m, etc. until races over 2100m+  are dealt with as a large group.

Nonetheless, within those divisions there are FITNESS PATTERNS/niches that
have percentage scores way over and above other PATTERNS around them.  

So in each race you have runners who had their last starts some days ago,
varying, and those gaps in the days have a value that increases, or
decreases, dependent on the time gap, and also affected by the distance of
the race to be contested. The authors research has shown, or revealed,
niches where runners are more likely to prove competitive, or importantly,
when and where they can be discounted as possibilities. Sprinters need time
to recuperate, distance runners need racing to keep them ticking along,
first uppers over sprint distances are dynamite (I said that), 3 runs in 31
days can be a good thing, or a bad thing, a great thing or an occasion when
a judgement is required - it's in the book.

Further reviews of the authors other books will be posted soon.

The Key Factor is Fitness 1997 - Barrymore Publications The Key Factor is
Fitness  - The System 1997 82 pages - Barrymore Publications The Secrets of
Class and other Key Factors 2000 180 pages - Barrymore Publications The
Secrets of Class - The System 2001 -80 pages - Barrymore Publications
Weights Right 2004 136 pages - Barrymore Publications These publications are
an intellectual investment in winner finding, horse racing generally, honest
and earnest reasoning regarding the punt. The Secrets of Class (both) are
well researched and well written. The same can be said of Weights Right. The
others are a little dated. All books hold true to the method(s) written
about in The Key Factor is Fitness. They are all out of print.

Thank you Mr Blakemore

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

--

This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.

 <https://www.avg.com> https://www.avg.com

 

 

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From seanmac4321 at gmail.com  Mon Oct 26 12:32:40 2020
From: seanmac4321 at gmail.com (sean mclaren)
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2020 11:32:40 +1000
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
In-Reply-To: <002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>
	<002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <CAOBDE-RA1i2LW_QQ2TRRPAo=PchhSCJ-w-f6i-DCG5ShUoY43A@mail.gmail.com>

hi guys.

i spent more time than i care to remember compiling fitness tables,
Blakemore style.

no joy.  and it wasn't marginal.

none, and i mean none, matched up to his recorded strike rates.

i tried with WA Metro Races, using a few thousand races.

and it wasn't marginal.

i'm being vague, as this was done a couple of years ago at least.

i don't have the time nor the inclination to go and revisit.

as you both are aware, i crunch WA and HK data.

BTW i don't make this stuff up.

Len, i am not surprised at your findings.













On Mon, Oct 26, 2020 at 9:47 AM L.B.Loveday <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> wrote:

> Tony,
>
>
>
> He got this wrong, at least in the context of Australian Thoroughbred
> races:
>
>
>
> There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called results) that
> shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated, ****more
> than their share****, more than people (other form tutors) give them
> credit for.
>
>
>
> Wrong, unconditionally wrong.
>
>
>
> I analysed 190,000+ first-uppers (excluding first-starters) in field of 8
> or more (so I can also compare Place performance, which I mostly bet), in
> races I have rated since 2005.
>
>
>
> First Ups win (and place) very significantly less than their share - 8.6%,
> 25.8% cf 9.3%, 28.1% for all runners, and significantly less than 2nd up
> (9.0, 26.9), and even more so than 3rd up (10.0, 29.3). Quickly, why are
> there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than 2nd ups?
>
>
>
> However, the market factors in the well-know (well I thought so) fact that
> first ups win much less than their share, and so the level stake return at
> SP of first ups is not significantly different to that of all runners.
>
>
>
> LBL
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
> Sent: Friday, 23 October 2020 1:27 AM
> To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
> Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
>
>
>
>
>
> Fitness -The Key to Winning
>
> Barry J Blakemore wrote a series of horse racing form study books.
>
> I have contacted the author and obtained his permission to quote from his
> books Copyright Barrymore Publications - PO Box 673 BUDERIM Queensland 4556
> Thank you Mr Blakemore Ref 07 5476***2
>
>
>
> "Fitness -The Key to Winning" 1993 (56 pages) says this:- 52% winning
> runners (from multiple runners) when runners conform with an exposed
> frequency, when runners start within a few days of a previous run their
> winning chances improve, markedly - I did not know that and it's in the
> book. Yes it is specific and applicable to a select group but it is a
> powerful stat and one that is repeated over various distances of races.
>
> The author uses FITNESS PATTERNS to show and explain the likely capability
> of horses generally, and specifically, if runners have attributes shown to
> enable them to win, run above expectations, or tire and lose.
>
> Runners, and their re-appearance at the races are categorized (simplified)
> as thus, these are the FITNESS PATTERNS
>
> 1 to 9 days - simplified to 7 days
>
> 10 to 17 days - simplified to 14 days
>
> 18 to 24 days - simplified to 21 days
>
> On up to
>
> 39 to 45 days - simplified to 42 days
>
> Horses running on or after the 46th day are considered to be first up.
> First up is a bonus. There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise
> called
>
> results) that shows first uppers win races, more than expected,
> calculated, more than their share, more than people (other form tutors)
> give them credit for.
>
> An example of how the book shows us FITNESS PATTERNS - a runner with 9
> days until its next run, then another run on the 19th day along until a
> third run on the 39th day in is shown as 9/19/39 which simplifies to
> 35/21/7 ( see above). Runs before the 9th day appearance are disregarded,
> considered to be
>
> too far back in the form score to affect its endeavours now.
>
> The author then divides races into divisions (1000/1100m-
> 1200m-1300/1400m, 1500/1600m, etc. until races over 2100m+  are dealt with
> as a large group.
>
> Nonetheless, within those divisions there are FITNESS PATTERNS/niches that
> have percentage scores way over and above other PATTERNS around them.
>
> So in each race you have runners who had their last starts some days ago,
> varying, and those gaps in the days have a value that increases, or
> decreases, dependent on the time gap, and also affected by the distance of
> the race to be contested. The authors research has shown, or revealed,
> niches where runners are more likely to prove competitive, or importantly,
> when and where they can be discounted as possibilities. Sprinters need time
> to recuperate, distance runners need racing to keep them ticking along,
> first uppers over sprint distances are dynamite (I said that), 3 runs in 31
> days can be a good thing, or a bad thing, a great thing or an occasion when
> a judgement is required - it's in the book.
>
> Further reviews of the authors other books will be posted soon.
>
> The Key Factor is Fitness 1997 - Barrymore Publications The Key Factor is
> Fitness  - The System 1997 82 pages - Barrymore Publications The Secrets of
> Class and other Key Factors 2000 180 pages - Barrymore Publications The
> Secrets of Class - The System 2001 -80 pages - Barrymore Publications
> Weights Right 2004 136 pages - Barrymore Publications These publications
> are an intellectual investment in winner finding, horse racing generally,
> honest and earnest reasoning regarding the punt. The Secrets of Class
> (both) are well researched and well written. The same can be said of
> Weights Right. The others are a little dated. All books hold true to the
> method(s) written about in The Key Factor is Fitness. They are all out of
> print.
>
> Thank you Mr Blakemore
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
>
>
> Tony
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
>
> https://www.avg.com
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Racing mailing list
>
> Racing at ausrace.com
>
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
> _______________________________________________
> Racing mailing list
> Racing at ausrace.com
> http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com
>
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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Tue Oct 27 00:59:36 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Mon, 26 Oct 2020 21:59:36 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
In-Reply-To: <002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>
	<002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <007001d6aba0$3e091cf0$ba1b56d0$@bigpond.com>

Len - thanks. My reply is full of data with decimal points, and the crux of
his book, and before I do post it here I offered the words I had written to
the author for his knowledge of my actions, and his approval of those. He
uses snail mail so please stand by.

 

Quickly, you ask, I don't know. P'raps, if you have done the math you have
this book? If so most of my reply is based on the table on page 31.

 

NEW SUBJECT: Is trainers, owners, those in the know, them betting with
information we, me, don't know a fiduciary advantage and thereby Insider
Trading, by definition? When will horse weights advice be mandatory?

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

From: Racing [mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 26 October 2020 7:47 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

Tony,

 

He got this wrong, at least in the context of Australian Thoroughbred races:

 

There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called results) that
shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated, ****more than
their share****, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit for.

 

Wrong, unconditionally wrong.

 

I analysed 190,000+ first-uppers (excluding first-starters) in field of 8 or
more (so I can also compare Place performance, which I mostly bet), in races
I have rated since 2005.

 

First Ups win (and place) very significantly less than their share - 8.6%,
25.8% cf 9.3%, 28.1% for all runners, and significantly less than 2nd up
(9.0, 26.9), and even more so than 3rd up (10.0, 29.3). Quickly, why are
there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than 2nd ups?

 

However, the market factors in the well-know (well I thought so) fact that
first ups win much less than their share, and so the level stake return at
SP of first ups is not significantly different to that of all runners.

 

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Friday, 23 October 2020 1:27 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

 

Fitness -The Key to Winning

Barry J Blakemore wrote a series of horse racing form study books. 

I have contacted the author and obtained his permission to quote from his
books Copyright Barrymore Publications - PO Box 673 BUDERIM Queensland 4556
Thank you Mr Blakemore Ref 07 5476***2 

 

"Fitness -The Key to Winning" 1993 (56 pages) says this:- 52% winning
runners (from multiple runners) when runners conform with an exposed
frequency, when runners start within a few days of a previous run their
winning chances improve, markedly - I did not know that and it's in the
book. Yes it is specific and applicable to a select group but it is a
powerful stat and one that is repeated over various distances of races.

The author uses FITNESS PATTERNS to show and explain the likely capability
of horses generally, and specifically, if runners have attributes shown to
enable them to win, run above expectations, or tire and lose.

Runners, and their re-appearance at the races are categorized (simplified)
as thus, these are the FITNESS PATTERNS

1 to 9 days - simplified to 7 days

10 to 17 days - simplified to 14 days

18 to 24 days - simplified to 21 days

On up to

39 to 45 days - simplified to 42 days

Horses running on or after the 46th day are considered to be first up. First
up is a bonus. There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called

results) that shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated,
more than their share, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit
for.

An example of how the book shows us FITNESS PATTERNS - a runner with 9 days
until its next run, then another run on the 19th day along until a third run
on the 39th day in is shown as 9/19/39 which simplifies to 35/21/7 ( see
above). Runs before the 9th day appearance are disregarded, considered to be

too far back in the form score to affect its endeavours now.     

The author then divides races into divisions (1000/1100m- 1200m-1300/1400m,
1500/1600m, etc. until races over 2100m+  are dealt with as a large group.

Nonetheless, within those divisions there are FITNESS PATTERNS/niches that
have percentage scores way over and above other PATTERNS around them.  

So in each race you have runners who had their last starts some days ago,
varying, and those gaps in the days have a value that increases, or
decreases, dependent on the time gap, and also affected by the distance of
the race to be contested. The authors research has shown, or revealed,
niches where runners are more likely to prove competitive, or importantly,
when and where they can be discounted as possibilities. Sprinters need time
to recuperate, distance runners need racing to keep them ticking along,
first uppers over sprint distances are dynamite (I said that), 3 runs in 31
days can be a good thing, or a bad thing, a great thing or an occasion when
a judgement is required - it's in the book.

Further reviews of the authors other books will be posted soon.

The Key Factor is Fitness 1997 - Barrymore Publications The Key Factor is
Fitness  - The System 1997 82 pages - Barrymore Publications The Secrets of
Class and other Key Factors 2000 180 pages - Barrymore Publications The
Secrets of Class - The System 2001 -80 pages - Barrymore Publications
Weights Right 2004 136 pages - Barrymore Publications These publications are
an intellectual investment in winner finding, horse racing generally, honest
and earnest reasoning regarding the punt. The Secrets of Class (both) are
well researched and well written. The same can be said of Weights Right. The
others are a little dated. All books hold true to the method(s) written
about in The Key Factor is Fitness. They are all out of print.

Thank you Mr Blakemore

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

--

This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.

 <https://www.avg.com> https://www.avg.com

 

 

_______________________________________________

Racing mailing list

 <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> Racing at ausrace.com

 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com>
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Tue Oct 27 04:24:52 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2020 04:24:52 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
In-Reply-To: <007001d6aba0$3e091cf0$ba1b56d0$@bigpond.com>
References: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>	<002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>
	<007001d6aba0$3e091cf0$ba1b56d0$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <001001d6abbc$ec1ad0b0$c4507210$@ozemail.com.au>

Tony,

 

Quickly, why are there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than
2nd ups?

 

Because a horse having its second run is, unless it was spelled after its
first run, 2nd up, but never had a first up, as distinct from first start
which is a separate class of run, as I specified - " first-uppers (excluding
first-starters)".

 

But a horse can only be 3rd up if it had a 2nd up, and some spell after the
2nd up, so there must be more 2nd up than 3rd up.

 

Is trainers, owners, those in the know, them betting with information we,
me, don't know a fiduciary advantage and thereby Insider Trading, by
definition? No.

 

When will horse weights advice be mandatory? When people are prepared to pay
enough?

 

LBL

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Tuesday, 27 October 2020 1:00 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

Len - thanks. My reply is full of data with decimal points, and the crux of
his book, and before I do post it here I offered the words I had written to
the author for his knowledge of my actions, and his approval of those. He
uses snail mail so please stand by.

 

Quickly, you ask, I don't know. P'raps, if you have done the math you have
this book? If so most of my reply is based on the table on page 31.

 

NEW SUBJECT: Is trainers, owners, those in the know, them betting with
information we, me, don't know a fiduciary advantage and thereby Insider
Trading, by definition? When will horse weights advice be mandatory?

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

From: Racing [mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 26 October 2020 7:47 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

Tony,

 

He got this wrong, at least in the context of Australian Thoroughbred races:

 

There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called results) that
shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated, ****more than
their share****, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit for.

 

Wrong, unconditionally wrong.

 

I analysed 190,000+ first-uppers (excluding first-starters) in field of 8 or
more (so I can also compare Place performance, which I mostly bet), in races
I have rated since 2005.

 

First Ups win (and place) very significantly less than their share - 8.6%,
25.8% cf 9.3%, 28.1% for all runners, and significantly less than 2nd up
(9.0, 26.9), and even more so than 3rd up (10.0, 29.3). Quickly, why are
there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than 2nd ups?

 

However, the market factors in the well-know (well I thought so) fact that
first ups win much less than their share, and so the level stake return at
SP of first ups is not significantly different to that of all runners.

 

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Friday, 23 October 2020 1:27 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

 

Fitness -The Key to Winning

Barry J Blakemore wrote a series of horse racing form study books. 

I have contacted the author and obtained his permission to quote from his
books Copyright Barrymore Publications - PO Box 673 BUDERIM Queensland 4556
Thank you Mr Blakemore Ref 07 5476***2 

 

"Fitness -The Key to Winning" 1993 (56 pages) says this:- 52% winning
runners (from multiple runners) when runners conform with an exposed
frequency, when runners start within a few days of a previous run their
winning chances improve, markedly - I did not know that and it's in the
book. Yes it is specific and applicable to a select group but it is a
powerful stat and one that is repeated over various distances of races.

The author uses FITNESS PATTERNS to show and explain the likely capability
of horses generally, and specifically, if runners have attributes shown to
enable them to win, run above expectations, or tire and lose.

Runners, and their re-appearance at the races are categorized (simplified)
as thus, these are the FITNESS PATTERNS

1 to 9 days - simplified to 7 days

10 to 17 days - simplified to 14 days

18 to 24 days - simplified to 21 days

On up to

39 to 45 days - simplified to 42 days

Horses running on or after the 46th day are considered to be first up. First
up is a bonus. There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called

results) that shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated,
more than their share, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit
for.

An example of how the book shows us FITNESS PATTERNS - a runner with 9 days
until its next run, then another run on the 19th day along until a third run
on the 39th day in is shown as 9/19/39 which simplifies to 35/21/7 ( see
above). Runs before the 9th day appearance are disregarded, considered to be

too far back in the form score to affect its endeavours now.     

The author then divides races into divisions (1000/1100m- 1200m-1300/1400m,
1500/1600m, etc. until races over 2100m+  are dealt with as a large group.

Nonetheless, within those divisions there are FITNESS PATTERNS/niches that
have percentage scores way over and above other PATTERNS around them.  

So in each race you have runners who had their last starts some days ago,
varying, and those gaps in the days have a value that increases, or
decreases, dependent on the time gap, and also affected by the distance of
the race to be contested. The authors research has shown, or revealed,
niches where runners are more likely to prove competitive, or importantly,
when and where they can be discounted as possibilities. Sprinters need time
to recuperate, distance runners need racing to keep them ticking along,
first uppers over sprint distances are dynamite (I said that), 3 runs in 31
days can be a good thing, or a bad thing, a great thing or an occasion when
a judgement is required - it's in the book.

Further reviews of the authors other books will be posted soon.

The Key Factor is Fitness 1997 - Barrymore Publications The Key Factor is
Fitness  - The System 1997 82 pages - Barrymore Publications The Secrets of
Class and other Key Factors 2000 180 pages - Barrymore Publications The
Secrets of Class - The System 2001 -80 pages - Barrymore Publications
Weights Right 2004 136 pages - Barrymore Publications These publications are
an intellectual investment in winner finding, horse racing generally, honest
and earnest reasoning regarding the punt. The Secrets of Class (both) are
well researched and well written. The same can be said of Weights Right. The
others are a little dated. All books hold true to the method(s) written
about in The Key Factor is Fitness. They are all out of print.

Thank you Mr Blakemore

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

--

This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.

 <https://www.avg.com> https://www.avg.com

 

 

_______________________________________________

Racing mailing list

 <mailto:Racing at ausrace.com> Racing at ausrace.com

 <http://ausrace.com/mailman/listinfo/racing_ausrace.com>
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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Tue Oct 27 11:09:31 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Tue, 27 Oct 2020 08:09:31 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system
In-Reply-To: <001001d6abbc$ec1ad0b0$c4507210$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <000301d6a87f$69912080$3cb36180$@bigpond.com>	<002701d6ab29$2a5460b0$7efd2210$@ozemail.com.au>	<007001d6aba0$3e091cf0$ba1b56d0$@bigpond.com>
	<001001d6abbc$ec1ad0b0$c4507210$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <005201d6abf5$7237b900$56a72b00$@bigpond.com>

You wrote: Because a horse having its second run is, unless it was spelled
after its first run, 2nd up, but never had a first up, as distinct from
first start which is a separate class of run, as I specified - "
first-uppers (excluding first-starters)". Right. 

 

My use of 'first uppers' (and the authors) is a horse with history that is
returning to the track - not its first run in a race.

 

First uppers running in a ( distance niche) win at 30+% - it's specific as
to distance, and there are a few of them running with those traits. So is
that information useable? Don't do form in races where there are first
uppers? Back them if their odds exceed their numerable presence? Always back
those in the market because money is truth and somebody knows something (and
you don't) apart from them being 'first uppers'?

 

Cheers

 

Tony

Still waiting for the mailgirl (Vicki)

 

 

From: Racing [mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Tuesday, 27 October 2020 1:25 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

Tony,

 

Quickly, why are there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than
2nd ups?

 

Because a horse having its second run is, unless it was spelled after its
first run, 2nd up, but never had a first up, as distinct from first start
which is a separate class of run, as I specified - " first-uppers (excluding
first-starters)".

 

But a horse can only be 3rd up if it had a 2nd up, and some spell after the
2nd up, so there must be more 2nd up than 3rd up.

 

Is trainers, owners, those in the know, them betting with information we,
me, don't know a fiduciary advantage and thereby Insider Trading, by
definition? No.

 

When will horse weights advice be mandatory? When people are prepared to pay
enough?

 

LBL

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Tuesday, 27 October 2020 1:00 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

Len - thanks. My reply is full of data with decimal points, and the crux of
his book, and before I do post it here I offered the words I had written to
the author for his knowledge of my actions, and his approval of those. He
uses snail mail so please stand by.

 

Quickly, you ask, I don't know. P'raps, if you have done the math you have
this book? If so most of my reply is based on the table on page 31.

 

NEW SUBJECT: Is trainers, owners, those in the know, them betting with
information we, me, don't know a fiduciary advantage and thereby Insider
Trading, by definition? When will horse weights advice be mandatory?

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

From: Racing [mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Monday, 26 October 2020 7:47 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

Tony,

 

He got this wrong, at least in the context of Australian Thoroughbred races:

 

There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called results) that
shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated, ****more than
their share****, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit for.

 

Wrong, unconditionally wrong.

 

I analysed 190,000+ first-uppers (excluding first-starters) in field of 8 or
more (so I can also compare Place performance, which I mostly bet), in races
I have rated since 2005.

 

First Ups win (and place) very significantly less than their share - 8.6%,
25.8% cf 9.3%, 28.1% for all runners, and significantly less than 2nd up
(9.0, 26.9), and even more so than 3rd up (10.0, 29.3). Quickly, why are
there more 2nd ups than First ups, but less 3rd ups than 2nd ups?

 

However, the market factors in the well-know (well I thought so) fact that
first ups win much less than their share, and so the level stake return at
SP of first ups is not significantly different to that of all runners.

 

 

LBL

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: Racing On Behalf Of Tony Moffat
Sent: Friday, 23 October 2020 1:27 AM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com
<mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: [AusRace] Fitness - The Key to Winning - a system

 

 

Fitness -The Key to Winning

Barry J Blakemore wrote a series of horse racing form study books. 

I have contacted the author and obtained his permission to quote from his
books Copyright Barrymore Publications - PO Box 673 BUDERIM Queensland 4556
Thank you Mr Blakemore Ref 07 5476***2 

 

"Fitness -The Key to Winning" 1993 (56 pages) says this:- 52% winning
runners (from multiple runners) when runners conform with an exposed
frequency, when runners start within a few days of a previous run their
winning chances improve, markedly - I did not know that and it's in the
book. Yes it is specific and applicable to a select group but it is a
powerful stat and one that is repeated over various distances of races.

The author uses FITNESS PATTERNS to show and explain the likely capability
of horses generally, and specifically, if runners have attributes shown to
enable them to win, run above expectations, or tire and lose.

Runners, and their re-appearance at the races are categorized (simplified)
as thus, these are the FITNESS PATTERNS

1 to 9 days - simplified to 7 days

10 to 17 days - simplified to 14 days

18 to 24 days - simplified to 21 days

On up to

39 to 45 days - simplified to 42 days

Horses running on or after the 46th day are considered to be first up. First
up is a bonus. There is plenty of statistical evidence (otherwise called

results) that shows first uppers win races, more than expected, calculated,
more than their share, more than people (other form tutors) give them credit
for.

An example of how the book shows us FITNESS PATTERNS - a runner with 9 days
until its next run, then another run on the 19th day along until a third run
on the 39th day in is shown as 9/19/39 which simplifies to 35/21/7 ( see
above). Runs before the 9th day appearance are disregarded, considered to be

too far back in the form score to affect its endeavours now.     

The author then divides races into divisions (1000/1100m- 1200m-1300/1400m,
1500/1600m, etc. until races over 2100m+  are dealt with as a large group.

Nonetheless, within those divisions there are FITNESS PATTERNS/niches that
have percentage scores way over and above other PATTERNS around them.  

So in each race you have runners who had their last starts some days ago,
varying, and those gaps in the days have a value that increases, or
decreases, dependent on the time gap, and also affected by the distance of
the race to be contested. The authors research has shown, or revealed,
niches where runners are more likely to prove competitive, or importantly,
when and where they can be discounted as possibilities. Sprinters need time
to recuperate, distance runners need racing to keep them ticking along,
first uppers over sprint distances are dynamite (I said that), 3 runs in 31
days can be a good thing, or a bad thing, a great thing or an occasion when
a judgement is required - it's in the book.

Further reviews of the authors other books will be posted soon.

The Key Factor is Fitness 1997 - Barrymore Publications The Key Factor is
Fitness  - The System 1997 82 pages - Barrymore Publications The Secrets of
Class and other Key Factors 2000 180 pages - Barrymore Publications The
Secrets of Class - The System 2001 -80 pages - Barrymore Publications
Weights Right 2004 136 pages - Barrymore Publications These publications are
an intellectual investment in winner finding, horse racing generally, honest
and earnest reasoning regarding the punt. The Secrets of Class (both) are
well researched and well written. The same can be said of Weights Right. The
others are a little dated. All books hold true to the method(s) written
about in The Key Factor is Fitness. They are all out of print.

Thank you Mr Blakemore

 

Cheers

 

Tony

 

 

 

 

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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct 28 13:23:25 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 13:23:25 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?
Message-ID: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>

Melbourne Cup this Saturday night, under lights I presume.

 

 



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From nick.aubrey at twonix.com  Wed Oct 28 19:24:26 2020
From: nick.aubrey at twonix.com (nick.aubrey)
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 19:24:26 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?
In-Reply-To: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <mailman.3.1615414009.7308.racing_ausrace.com@ausrace.com>


Ha ha that's funny.?Len where did u see that? is it online ?Cheers,ANSent on the go with Vodafone
-------- Original message --------From: "L.B.Loveday" <lloveday at ozemail.com.au> Date: 28/10/20  1:23 pm  (GMT+10:00) To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com> Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees? Melbourne Cup this Saturday night, under lights I presume.??
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Wed Oct 28 19:29:02 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 19:29:02 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?
In-Reply-To: <5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>
References: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>
Message-ID: <006c01d6ad04$667338f0$3359aad0$@ozemail.com.au>

Yes Nick, TAB.com.au, click Jackpots top left, scroll down and there it is!

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of nick.aubrey
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 19:24 PM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

 

Ha ha that's funny. 

Len where did u see that? is it online ?

Cheers,

AN

 

 

 

Sent on the go with Vodafone

 

 

-------- Original message --------

From: "L.B.Loveday" <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > 

Date: 28/10/20 1:23 pm (GMT+10:00) 

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> > 

Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees? 

 

Melbourne Cup this Saturday night, under lights I presume.

 

 



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From RaceStats at hotmail.com  Wed Oct 28 21:51:19 2020
From: RaceStats at hotmail.com (Race Stats)
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 10:51:19 +0000
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?
In-Reply-To: <006c01d6ad04$667338f0$3359aad0$@ozemail.com.au>
References: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>
	<006c01d6ad04$667338f0$3359aad0$@ozemail.com.au>
Message-ID: <MN2PR04MB58212EE292837A3A81C8F975BB170@MN2PR04MB5821.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>

Perhaps they?ll put this up for the trots Miracle Mile ?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carting#/media/File:Dog_carting_by_beach.jpg


From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com> On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 7:29 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

Yes Nick, TAB.com.au, click Jackpots top left, scroll down and there it is!


From: Racing On Behalf Of nick.aubrey
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 19:24 PM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com<mailto:racing at ausrace.com>>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

Ha ha that's funny.
Len where did u see that? is it online ?
Cheers,
AN



Sent on the go with Vodafone


-------- Original message --------
From: "L.B.Loveday" <lloveday at ozemail.com.au<mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au>>
Date: 28/10/20 1:23 pm (GMT+10:00)
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com<mailto:racing at ausrace.com>>
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

Melbourne Cup this Saturday night, under lights I presume.


[cid:image001.png at 01D6AD74.74CCF8D0]
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From tonymoffat at bigpond.com  Wed Oct 28 22:13:29 2020
From: tonymoffat at bigpond.com (Tony Moffat)
Date: Wed, 28 Oct 2020 19:13:29 +0800
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?
In-Reply-To: <MN2PR04MB58212EE292837A3A81C8F975BB170@MN2PR04MB5821.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
References: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>	<5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>	<006c01d6ad04$667338f0$3359aad0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<MN2PR04MB58212EE292837A3A81C8F975BB170@MN2PR04MB5821.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
Message-ID: <001701d6ad1b$5e328620$1a979260$@bigpond.com>

Could it be that Saturday night is when they start selling for Tuesday Cup?

The final field won?t be known until then (1730 local)

 

From: Racing [mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com] On Behalf Of Race Stats
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 6:51 PM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

 

Perhaps they?ll put this up for the trots Miracle Mile ?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carting#/media/File:Dog_carting_by_beach.jpg

 

 

From: Racing <racing-bounces at ausrace.com <mailto:racing-bounces at ausrace.com> > On Behalf Of L.B.Loveday
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 7:29 PM
To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

 

Yes Nick, TAB.com.au, click Jackpots top left, scroll down and there it is!

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of nick.aubrey
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 19:24 PM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> >
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

 

Ha ha that's funny. 

Len where did u see that? is it online ?

Cheers,

AN

 

 

 

Sent on the go with Vodafone

 

 

-------- Original message --------

From: "L.B.Loveday" <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > 

Date: 28/10/20 1:23 pm (GMT+10:00) 

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> > 

Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees? 

 

Melbourne Cup this Saturday night, under lights I presume.

 

 





-- 
This email has been checked for viruses by AVG.
https://www.avg.com
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From greg.j.conroy at gmail.com  Fri Oct 30 10:56:50 2020
From: greg.j.conroy at gmail.com (Greg Conroy)
Date: Fri, 30 Oct 2020 10:56:50 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Winxwheel.com
In-Reply-To: <001701d6ad1b$5e328620$1a979260$@bigpond.com>
References: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>
	<006c01d6ad04$667338f0$3359aad0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<MN2PR04MB58212EE292837A3A81C8F975BB170@MN2PR04MB5821.namprd04.prod.outlook.com>
	<001701d6ad1b$5e328620$1a979260$@bigpond.com>
Message-ID: <0D4511B4-2395-4EF8-B00E-D2901CD42C0B@gmail.com>

Howdy all,

I?ve created a little niche which some maybe interested in ? 

It?s called www.winxwheel.com <http://www.winxwheel.com/>

I want it to be a home of racing related products and offers.

Each week I plan to put up another offer (until I hit 25, for obvious reasons after you visit!)

If anyone has any products/services that you think you?d like to get traction for similar to the first three offers I?ve put up then contact me and we can see what we can put together.

Cheers, Greg
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From lloveday at ozemail.com.au  Sat Oct 31 13:09:51 2020
From: lloveday at ozemail.com.au (L.B.Loveday)
Date: Sat, 31 Oct 2020 13:09:51 +1100
Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?
In-Reply-To: <5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>
References: <003601d6acd1$5ea74090$1bf5c1b0$@ozemail.com.au>
	<5c1d5d$9t360f@irony-in37.icp.internal.iinet.net.au>
Message-ID: <006b01d6af2a$ecf2a320$c6d7e960$@ozemail.com.au>

And still there; the incompetence of so many young these days is, to me, incredible.

 

 

From: Racing On Behalf Of nick.aubrey
Sent: Wednesday, 28 October 2020 19:24 PM
To: AusRace Racing Discussion List <racing at ausrace.com>
Subject: Re: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees?

 

Ha ha that's funny. 

Len where did u see that? is it online ?

Cheers,

AN

 

 

 

Sent on the go with Vodafone

 

 

-------- Original message --------

From: "L.B.Loveday" <lloveday at ozemail.com.au <mailto:lloveday at ozemail.com.au> > 

Date: 28/10/20 1:23 pm (GMT+10:00) 

To: 'AusRace Racing Discussion List' <racing at ausrace.com <mailto:racing at ausrace.com> > 

Subject: [AusRace] Where do TAB get their employees? 

 

Melbourne Cup this Saturday night, under lights I presume.

 

 



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